View Thread : Were going to the moon again!


alien space marine
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040109/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush_space

A step in the right direction , Well Bush did somthing good this time.

The idea of a Lunar base like off austin powers is kind of funny, It would actually be a better enviroment then the space station due to low gravity. I hope they revisit the armstrong shin dig and give those old rusty lunar scooters a try (if they still work).

also why not form a north american space agency ! The U.S would have canadian financial bonus and technology, We gave that big arm on the space shuttle and a few astronauts.

Great Rumbler
I think it's cool that they're thinking about another moon mission.

DMiller
Yeah, I've gotten really interested in space lately with all the talk about going back to the moon, and those pictures from Mars are incredible. Kind of makes me wish I had become an astronomer (or astronaut) which was one of many of my childhood dream jobs.

A Black Falcon
Cool! NASA definitely needed to move past just the shuttles... I don't know if it's a good idea now, with this economy, but science is always a good thing. As long as we fund it well enough that is... but a moon base? Starting work on that is long overdue, I think. The shuttle was a good idea but it let NASA stagnate pretty badly. They also need to really work on that replacement for the shuttle...

Ryan
Hopefully this will silence those silly rumors about us never going in the first place.

alien space marine
Those conspirousy theorist are full of crap their claims entirely have been debunked. They even claimed the Apollo 1 astronauts were assinated not the victims of a tragic accident.

http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/tv/foxapollo.html

thats a interesting site and you can learn alot of science by debunking bad science.



Bad: The first bit of actual evidence brought up is the lack of stars in the pictures taken by the Apollo astronauts from the surface of the Moon. Without air, the sky is black, so where are the stars?

Good: The stars are there! They're just too faint to be seen.

This is usually the first thing HBs talk about when discussing the Hoax. That amazes me, as it's the silliest assertion they make. However, it appeals to our common sense: when the sky is black here on Earth, we see stars. Therefore we should see them from the Moon as well.

I'll say this here now, and return to it many times: the Moon is not the Earth. Conditions there are weird, and our common sense is likely to fail us.

The Moon's surface is airless. On Earth, our thick atmosphere scatters sunlight, spreading it out over the whole sky. That's why the sky is bright during the day. Without sunlight, the air is dark at night, allowing us to see stars.

On the Moon, the lack of air means that the sky is dark. Even when the Sun is high off the horizon during full day, the sky near it will be black. If you were standing on the Moon, you would indeed see stars, even during the day.

So why aren't they in the Apollo pictures? Pretend for a moment you are an astronaut on the surface of the Moon. You want to take a picture of your fellow space traveler. The Sun is low off the horizon, since all the lunar landings were done at local morning. How do you set your camera? The lunar landscape is brightly lit by the Sun, of course, and your friend is wearing a white spacesuit also brilliantly lit by the Sun. To take a picture of a bright object with a bright background, you need to set the exposure time to be fast, and close down the aperture setting too; that's like the pupil in your eye constricting to let less light in when you walk outside on a sunny day.

So the picture you take is set for bright objects. Stars are faint objects! In the fast exposure, they simply do not have time to register on the film. It has nothing to do with the sky being black or the lack of air, it's just a matter of exposure time. If you were to go outside here on Earth on the darkest night imaginable and take a picture with the exact same camera settings the astronauts used, you won't see any stars!

It's that simple. Remember, this the usually the first and strongest argument the HBs use, and it was that easy to show wrong. Their arguments get worse from here.

A Black Falcon
Right, those people are too stupid for words...

Darunia
Holy shit, this is the greates thing ever! Words cannot express my excitement. This'll be the biggest thing any of us ever live to see; the mission to mars.

Great Rumbler
Mission to Mars...I kind of liked that movie.

alien space marine
Bad astronomy.com Debunked that movie pretty hard , (not that it was bad)Armageddon is worse hit for being the most scientifically inaccurate.

Great Rumbler
Like I care if they are accurate or not.

-iLluSiON-
Although it's interesting, I just knew he'd do it.

Seeing about how interested Americans are in the rover and its pictures, it is obvious that Bush is saying this for political gain. What do you want when you're running for office again? You want to get the public's eye. It's exactly what he's doing.

Someone was going to say it, and he finally did. Hooray.

*likes the idea, but still hates bush*

We should send an ape to Mars first. Hmm.. let's see.. president Bush anyone?

alien space marine
Your face wont turn too Ice instantly if you take your space mask off, Its not like you turn to ice if you put your head in a freezer.

Red planet was given good grades for accuracy though.(Val Keilmoore)

DMiller
This isn't changing my opinion on Bush, but I'll have a tough time choosing who to vote for if Dean gets chosen by the Dems because I don't like him too much either.

Darunia
it is obvious that Bush is saying this for political gain.

So what you're saying is that any GOOD thing that Bush does is for publicity alone. I suppose that, by comparison, any GOOD thing a Democrat would do wouldn't be politically motivated, but out of the goodness of his heart.

Bush saves the world = that bastard, only did it for attention! He's only concerned with getting re-elected.

Dean/Clark/Clinton/Gore save the world=God bless them! Those gods amongst men, why would anyone not vote for them!

-iLluSiON-
Bush and Iraq.
Do you think you can honestly make a true democracy out of a country that has three different groups of people living in it? How is that possible? Not to mention he wasted over 287 BILLION dollars on it. He's an idiot. Iraq did not have weapons of mass destruction. It's all about the oil my friend. You should try to step out of the country once in a while, Darunia... maybe even step out of the supermarket you once worked at (me too!!) but got fired for stealing 33 cents of turkey. You need to look at reality.

He should have held his focus more towards North Korea and Kim Jong. Jong is a lunatic and a half.

Back on topic.. it's a good idea.. but believe me, because it's election time, it's the reason why he's saying it now and not 3 years ago. next thing you know we're going to find Osama Bin Fuckin Laden (I agree with the Afghan mission... but Iraq? Please) and the Chimp is going to get elected again.

A Black Falcon
Oh, this doesn't change my opinion of Bush at all. For one, I'm sure he will underfund this like every other good program he has supported, starting with education. He'll talk big and not just underpreform but do so in a big way. Like usual. And he'll use the money not doing what he said he would to give more corporate kickbacks to the companies who funded his campaign. Or to weaken governmental regulations, whichever is easier at the minuite...

It really is amazing what this administration has done. It's the worst administration on the environment in decades and decades. It turned a large surplus into the biggest deficit ever in two simple tax cuts. ... the list is just so insanely long ... but I could mention also how he has a education policy vastly underfunded and specifically designed so that it's impossible to pass (over time) too...

And yes, this is a campaign thing. Just like Iraq was. I mean, sure, he also wanted the oil and the contracts to give to his buddies, but getting that boost in the polls was at least as important...

And the biggest problem is that he based it all on lies. WMD? Iraq had none. Not one. Nothing. Exactly as the UN inspectors said before the war. Making the administration look like the liars they are. Sadaam? No connections between Sadaam and 9/11. No proven connections between Sadaam and Al Quaida except for safe haven to one Al Quaida-friendly terrorist group. Mass graves? Mostly from the '80s and early '90s... when we were either giving him strong support or were turning a blind eye while he massacred his people... or sometimes, taking pictures with him, like Donald Rumsfeld's famous pic with Sadaam...

-iLluSiON-
^agrees^
well said! let us join forces against Darunia.

alien space marine
That Clark guy looks like a good choice for president, In canada were having a election too.

Ryan
Originally posted by -iLluSiON-
^agrees^
well said! let us join forces against Darunia.

*activates Goron-Weltall alliance*

Bring it on :love:

Darunia
Do you think you can honestly make a true democracy out of a country that has three different groups of people living in it?

"True democracy" does not exist. A quasi-democracy will work though, as it does in America.

*Activates 650,000 Goron conscripts; signs Double-Entente with Weltall. Mobilizes Goron 1rst, 3rd and 7th armies. Orders all Goron outposts around the globe to be put on full alert.*

-iLluSiON-
Any form of government in Iraq will be hard to establish. It's not that easy to establish a new form of government right after the fall of another... Even "quasi-democracy". The fact remains, there's always going to be political squabbles and fights over everything. Iraq is a place that has barely any unity within; the groups that live there have different views on life and practice different religions. We're trying to modernize a country that is full of tradition and rituals. It's going to take years for the government to be fully effective. By then, fossil fuels are going to be useless to us.

Bush = idiot
Darunia = inconsiderate asshole who declares war because he can't do anything else
Black Falcon = better than Darunia.

OB1
Woo! I want to live on the moon!

alien space marine
Maybe we should leave in a great exodus to the Moon , We can call ourselves the Lunar Nation! The capital is Armstrong City!
We will have to create artificial gravity somtime if its possible.

Great Rumbler
There's an Asyrian journalist who's saying that Syria is storing Iraq's WMDs in underground bases. I don't how reliable this journalist is, but that's what he said.

alien space marine
If its true maybe we should put saunctions on them.

OB1
Or maybe the missiles are on the moon!!

Great Rumbler
To the moon!!

OB1
*puts on goggles*

All set!

Great Rumbler
Wooo!! On the Moon Party!!

OB1
I'm there!!

alien space marine
Having a party on the moon would be cool!

Great Rumbler
You know it!

OB1
But we don't have space suits... or goggles...

alien space marine
Inside a space ship !

OB1
Yea-- uh, yeah... muh.... wha?

A Black Falcon
Any form of government in Iraq will be hard to establish. It's not that easy to establish a new form of government right after the fall of another... Even "quasi-democracy". The fact remains, there's always going to be political squabbles and fights over everything. Iraq is a place that has barely any unity within; the groups that live there have different views on life and practice different religions. We're trying to modernize a country that is full of tradition and rituals. It's going to take years for the government to be fully effective. By then, fossil fuels are going to be useless to us.

Bush = idiot
Darunia = inconsiderate asshole who declares war because he can't do anything else
Black Falcon = better than Darunia.

Doesn't take much to be better than Darunia... :)

And you're right, it'll be years until the major problems in Iraq are dealt with. It is a people with not just no history of democracy, but with no history of unity except under a strongman. That is a major problem. The main comparisons here are Germany and Japan. Germany had already had an experiment with democracy and was united. Japan was autocratic, but had a very strong tradition of following orders and when told that the militarists were bad and democracy is the new thing people followed. Iraq doesn't have either of those... it's got disunity and autocracy instead. That means that it will take a long time to do it right. Six or seven years like we were in Germany and Japan? Minimum. And then you need to factor in how the longer we are there alone the more they will hate us... that is the opposite of Germany and Japan, where it got better as it went along. That will also be a major problem. What we need to do is bring in the international community. There is no other way to do this in a way that will truly work. Bringing in the international community in a meaningful way... it means not just asking for troops, but giving international organizations power in Iraq. Staying in the current 'just us' system will not work. Iraqis will realize more and more how it's just an occupation and how we are exploiting them with fat contracts to American companies who gave lots of money to the administration. And they already see it... they see us occupying their land and not letting in the international community. I know Bush hates the rest of the world, but the Iraqis don't... they like most of the world more than they like us, for sure. We need to realize that! Sure, we can put enough troops in to lessen attacks, but they won't be stopped until we both bring in international control, and troops... not just to present more targets, but to show skeptical Iraqis that we are not being unilateral. It's an absolutely vital step and without it we will not have nearly as much success in Iraq and there'll be a lot more violence lasting longer.

Oh yeah, and we need to focus on Afghanistan! We are ignoring it! That nation desperately, desperately needs serious help, and only we can give the push that gets it... most importantly it needs peacekeepers in the capitol. But it also needs adaquate funding...

And finally we just need to realize that because of realities in Iraq it'll be dangerous for American troops for many years to come. Especially with the very slow pace of political progress being made. A lot of Iraqis won't believe us until we actually give power to an Iraqi government... but that requires a lot of time consuming steps first. There is no good solution here, but we should do what we can starting with international control.

alien space marine
Cutting off the french and germans just because they oppposed the war is rash, Why was canada also excluded from reconstruction maybe it is because of the little shit Chreitein and his big mouth,But Chreitien is gone now and canada has had a change of leadership that is more pro unity between the U.S.

Canada just felt that going in with the U.S was too risky and we had alot at stake so we stayed neutral. But canada would love to help Iraq for the sake of the iraqis and we dont care about profiting off of this war like so many other countries that went.
We have had years of country building experience and we would lend a hand.

A Black Falcon
Bush would rather reward big campaign donors than stupid foreign countries.

Darunia
A Canadian who is so proud of his country, and he can't even spell his leader's name. Chreitien; Chreitein?

A Black Falcon
Crechien "retired" so spelling his name isn't as much of an issue anymore. His replacement has a English name, but I don't remember it... :)

-iLluSiON-
Doesn't make sense to me that Darunia claims to be an all-out Athiest but is a hard-nosed Conservative assbutt. He should be a liberal. Let's convert.

A Black Falcon
Yeah, conservative atheists are rare, but Darunia fits more with conservatives... see his racism, which is normal for them...

Ryan
Originally posted by A Black Falcon
Yeah, conservative atheists are rare, but Darunia fits more with conservatives... see his racism, which is normal for them...

All Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, Farrakhan, Julian Bond, Kwesi Mfume? Affirmative action quotas? The reparations movement?

Last I heard, these major sources of racism were quite to the left of center.

Oh wait, it's against white people. That's okay. That kind of racism is acceptable... no, encouraged. Racism only exists against black people, from white conservatives. Silly me for forgetting that little detail.

alien space marine
:topic:

A Black Falcon
Affirmative action isn't racism. As for the rest of those people, some are worse than others... and yes some black leaders do go too far. But when there's as long a history of discrimination against their people as there is against the blacks, they have some cause to be worried about the issue...

Ryan
Affirmative action isn't racism. As for the rest of those people, some are worse than others... and yes some black leaders do go too far. But when there's as long a history of discrimination against their people as there is against the blacks, they have some cause to be worried about the issue...
Which is exactly what I was saying about the left's thinking: It's okay for them to be racist. They have the right to be racist. It's okay for me to be discriminated against because other people who had roughly the same amount of melanin in their skin did the same thing long before I was even born. Those people aren't 'concerned' about the issue. Racism and segregation are perfectly simpatico with them, just so long as it's not them on the recieving end of it. And they are far more active, influential and virulent racists than any white conservative out there.

And any program that favors one person over another based on skin color is racist. That's what racism is, if you didn't know. That's what Dr. King died trying to end. His message was equality, not "some people are more equal than others".

A Black Falcon
No, supporting one group over another isn't racism when that group is clearly disadvantaged and can't be brought to a level equal with the main group unless you give it some advantages. And that's what affirmative action does.

And if you think that racism against blacks is something that only happened in the past you are insane...

Moiraine
:topic:

http://www.nicksildesigns.com/forumpics/NoOneCares.jpg

-iLluSiON-
Darunia is black.

Ryan
No, supporting one group over another isn't racism when that group is clearly disadvantaged and can't be brought to a level equal with the main group unless you give it some advantages. And that's what affirmative action does. Disadvantages? What disadvantages? Not physical or mental. You make it sound as though blacks are an inferior subspecies that is incapable of existing on the same level as whites, and that isn't true. The disadvantages of black people are in their condition, which is caused mostly by failed social programs. To erase inequality you have to level the playing field at a different level. You can't put two different people in the same job, when one has a college education and one is a high-school dropout. It won't work that way. To make blacks and whites truly equal, first the whole concept of race has to be eliminated (liberals of course don't want that), the second is to start the equalization process from the very beginning: Better schools (which liberals, fighting school vouchers, also do not want). You can't give them twenty years of failure and THEN start the process. It puts everyone at a disadvantage: The 'beneficiaries' who are given things they aren't prepared to handle for the sake of equality, and the others who are qualified but denied from the racial quota.

Fortunately, most black families see that vouchers are the only way out of the mess. Unfortunately, liberal democrats know that the black vote is a big one, and if they allow black people to succeed and become truly equal in society, they will have no need for the democrats and will lose that vote. So the left spreads lies of hatred and racism to scare blacks into voting democrat. They spread lies about how we want to re-enslave them, how we are nazis and the voucher program will only benefit rich white people (an absurd claim if ever one was made). Fortunately, it seems like blacks are starting to ignore it in a very important way.

And if you think that racism against blacks is something that only happened in the past you are insane... Some people are still racist. That will never change unfortunately. But once upon a time in America, racism against blacks was officially sanctioned and encouraged. It was acceptable and right at one time. It was official government policy. That is nowhere near the case anymore for black people. Most people aren't racist, because as a society we have matured. Most people, at the very least, are tolerant, if distant to other races and creeds. However, there is official government policy now practicing the very same thing in reverse. There is nothing different in the practice of denying jobs to whites in favor of blacks than there was early on in Nazi Germany when Jews were denied jobs in favor of Aryan Germans. The Germans used the exact same reason you do: "We were taken advantage of by the Jews". Official racism against blacks is very wrong. Two wrongs don't make a right. The Germans were wrong, and so are you.

A Black Falcon
You are so deluded and crazy that I really don't think even trying to say anything would make any sense.

A Black Falcon
I will a little but won't waste too much time on it.


Disadvantages? What disadvantages? Not physical or mental. You make it sound as though blacks are an inferior subspecies that is incapable of existing on the same level as whites, and that isn't true. The disadvantages of black people are in their condition, which is caused mostly by failed social programs. To erase inequality you have to level the playing field at a different level. You can't put two different people in the same job, when one has a college education and one is a high-school dropout. It won't work that way. To make blacks and whites truly equal, first the whole concept of race has to be eliminated (liberals of course don't want that), the second is to start the equalization process from the very beginning: Better schools (which liberals, fighting school vouchers, also do not want). You can't give them twenty years of failure and THEN start the process. It puts everyone at a disadvantage: The 'beneficiaries' who are given things they aren't prepared to handle for the sake of equality, and the others who are qualified but denied from the racial quota.

Fortunately, most black families see that vouchers are the only way out of the mess. Unfortunately, liberal democrats know that the black vote is a big one, and if they allow black people to succeed and become truly equal in society, they will have no need for the democrats and will lose that vote. So the left spreads lies of hatred and racism to scare blacks into voting democrat. They spread lies about how we want to re-enslave them, how we are nazis and the voucher program will only benefit rich white people (an absurd claim if ever one was made). Fortunately, it seems like blacks are starting to ignore it in a very important way.

You just do not want to understand the concept that sometimes people in disadvantaged situations need additional laws so that they can be equal. It isn't racism any more than the laws that make it illegal to fire people over their ethnicity (or many other things) is... it is trying to make everyone equal. The only way to make everyone equal is to help the people on the bottom. You do that with laws that help people on the bottom get on to a more level playing field with the people who have more. In this country, blacks as a group are far poorer than whites. That is just a fact -- a large percentage of the black community is poor and has been for a long time. And when you're poor for that long you lose hope of improvement... that's what's happened here. Some blacks can help themselves, but not most. Nowhere near. So we need to help them because leaving them in opressed in poverty like conservatives want to do is a cruel thing. Affirmative action is a great way to do that. It helps people who would otherwise have no chance of ever going to college to get there... a great way to help people who can't do it for themselves. It makes things somewhat more fair. Oh, it's still tilted towards whites, but affirmative action makes it a bit fairer.

And if you say that it gives them advantages I'll just repeat the fact that they are poorer and cannot afford all the aids that people with more money can. Yes, black society does seem to not want to get out of it's situation when you look at rappers and stuff... but then you see that those guys get rich and get out themselves...

And I've said all I can about vouchers. It'll help a couple of kids in poor schools and doom the rest in those schools to an even worse education, which is a very bad deal for society as a whole.

Some people are still racist. That will never change unfortunately. But once upon a time in America, racism against blacks was officially sanctioned and encouraged. It was acceptable and right at one time. It was official government policy. That is nowhere near the case anymore for black people. Most people aren't racist, because as a society we have matured. Most people, at the very least, are tolerant, if distant to other races and creeds. However, there is official government policy now practicing the very same thing in reverse. There is nothing different in the practice of denying jobs to whites in favor of blacks than there was early on in Nazi Germany when Jews were denied jobs in favor of Aryan Germans. The Germans used the exact same reason you do: "We were taken advantage of by the Jews". Official racism against blacks is very wrong. Two wrongs don't make a right. The Germans were wrong, and so are you

Oh, people say that they aren't racist, that is true, but in their hearts? Far more people than you admit are. And yes, it was government policy to opress. The result was that they were opressed and still haven't recovered. We need to improve all of them, not just the smartest or most athletic ones like vouchers would! We need to fundamentally change how we deal with 'failing schools' in a way that would give them not just more chances but would have some kind of program for success... removing money is not the way to go. You need to do something in the school to improve things. We can't just leave kids in failing schools and say by effect 'we don't care about you, because you aren't good enough to get into private schools you are stuck in poverty for life'... that is not right! It is not right to say that the rich or the lucky ones who can get rich should be able to exploit that... but that's fundamental right-wing policy...

And as for giving blacks a chance, again, that's just trying to make things fair. There is no other way to do it, really... without those laws almost all of those jobs would go to whites and the blacks would be where people like you think they belong -- stuck forever in ghettos...

Ryan
You just do not want to understand the concept that sometimes people in disadvantaged situations need additional laws so that they can be equal. It isn't racism any more than the laws that make it illegal to fire people over their ethnicity (or many other things) is... it is trying to make everyone equal. The only way to make everyone equal is to help the people on the bottom. You do that with laws that help people on the bottom get on to a more level playing field with the people who have more. In this country, blacks as a group are far poorer than whites. That is just a fact -- a large percentage of the black community is poor and has been for a long time. And when you're poor for that long you lose hope of improvement... that's what's happened here. Some blacks can help themselves, but not most. Nowhere near. So we need to help them because leaving them in opressed in poverty like conservatives want to do is a cruel thing. Affirmative action is a great way to do that. It helps people who would otherwise have no chance of ever going to college to get there... a great way to help people who can't do it for themselves. It makes things somewhat more fair. Oh, it's still tilted towards whites, but affirmative action makes it a bit fairer.
I agree with all of that, except that by that point in life it's too late. If we are to do affirmative action, it needs to be done in schools. Not in the workplace. It needs to be done by doing SOMETHING radically different with the school system. The public system is a tremendous failure. And your only solution is to throw more money at it and hope the problem goes away.

I as a conservative do not want anyone in poverty. I think everyone should work as hard as they can to avoid poverty. I also think if you're going to get help to avoid poverty it needs to start from the very beginning, and to do that we must abandon the ruinous education policies that, thanks to liberals, have given us the worst AND the most expensive public school network in the history of the nation. And yet you want MORE MONEY. But it obviously isn't doing anything.

And if you say that it gives them advantages I'll just repeat the fact that they are poorer and cannot afford all the aids that people with more money can. Yes, black society does seem to not want to get out of it's situation when you look at rappers and stuff... but then you see that those guys get rich and get out themselves...
And why does black society not want to get out of its situation? You people and your handout policy. For decades you have given these people money and have completely destroyed their work ethic and motivation. It is the left that have created this mess.

And I've said all I can about vouchers. It'll help a couple of kids in poor schools and doom the rest in those schools to an even worse education, which is a very bad deal for society as a whole.
Worse? How can they get any worse? To quote Chevy Chase, "we're at the threshold of Hell" education-wise. And while you bemoan vouchers, you don't offer one single good alternative. It's the age-old liberal response: "throw more money at it and hope it goes away".

Oh, people say that they aren't racist, that is true, but in their hearts? Far more people than you admit are. And yes, it was government policy to opress. The result was that they were opressed and still haven't recovered. We need to improve all of them, not just the smartest or most athletic ones like vouchers would! We need to fundamentally change how we deal with 'failing schools' in a way that would give them not just more chances but would have some kind of program for success... removing money is not the way to go. You need to do something in the school to improve things. We can't just leave kids in failing schools and say by effect 'we don't care about you, because you aren't good enough to get into private schools you are stuck in poverty for life'... that is not right! It is not right to say that the rich or the lucky ones who can get rich should be able to exploit that... but that's fundamental right-wing policy...
Well, all the left has done is make things worse. They create racial rifts, promote racism and class warfare, all the while doing everything they can to keep blacks as an endandered species. What if we funded public schools as well as they could be? It wouldn't be enough, because you also oppose standardization. If public schools were PERFECTLY funded, liberals would change from "rich vs. poor" to "Intelligent vs. 'underpriveledged'". You would complain, much as you do now, that unintelligent children do not have an equal chance to succeed with standards and it's discriminatory. Obviously, since you couldn't use that terminology, you would replace "unintelligent" with "black", because liberals are fundamentally racist, but too dishonest to be forthright about it.

And as for giving blacks a chance, again, that's just trying to make things fair. There is no other way to do it, really... without those laws almost all of those jobs would go to whites and the blacks would be where people like you think they belong -- stuck forever in ghettos...
If people like me think blacks belong in ghettos, why is it that people like you do the most to ensure they stay there?

A Black Falcon
It's so sad that you actually believe such things... or it would be if it wasn't so scary.

I agree with all of that, except that by that point in life it's too late. If we are to do affirmative action, it needs to be done in schools. Not in the workplace. It needs to be done by doing SOMETHING radically different with the school system. The public system is a tremendous failure. And your only solution is to throw more money at it and hope the problem goes away.

Money alone doesn't solve problems, no. However, given that funding cuts in education is one of the first things any decent conservative political group does when it can, and that public education is chronically underfunded, more funding will go a long way to help... more funding and raising the pay of teachers. That is critical. Teachers need to be paid well enough so that good people will actually want to teach -- right now that just is not true in the majority. But there are other things too... standards? Yes, if they are targeted well and are balanced and respond to local conditions and don't discriminate against some schools because they have more minority groups or special ed students... oh yeah, and are aimed to actually fix public education and not just destroy it like Bush's are trying to do.

And why does black society not want to get out of its situation? You people and your handout policy. For decades you have given these people money and have completely destroyed their work ethic and motivation. It is the left that have created this mess.

The problem dates from far, far before recent attempts at reconciling with centuries of unfairness.

Worse? How can they get any worse? To quote Chevy Chase, "we're at the threshold of Hell" education-wise. And while you bemoan vouchers, you don't offer one single good alternative. It's the age-old liberal response: "throw more money at it and hope it goes away".

Another classic right-wing tactic -- act like schools are so broken that they cannot be fixed. Like so many things right wingers say, it's just lies.

Well, all the left has done is make things worse. They create racial rifts, promote racism and class warfare, all the while doing everything they can to keep blacks as an endandered species. What if we funded public schools as well as they could be? It wouldn't be enough, because you also oppose standardization. If public schools were PERFECTLY funded, liberals would change from "rich vs. poor" to "Intelligent vs. 'underpriveledged'". You would complain, much as you do now, that unintelligent children do not have an equal chance to succeed with standards and it's discriminatory. Obviously, since you couldn't use that terminology, you would replace "unintelligent" with "black", because liberals are fundamentally racist, but too dishonest to be forthright about it.

Underpriviliged people aren't necessarially dumb... and there is a big, big difference between being unintelligent because your school failed you and you can't see a reason to care and actually being dumb. You seem to see those as the same, but they are't at all.. if public schools were perfectly funded we could seriously work on fixing the reasons that first group doesn't succeed and it would be a great thing.

If people like me think blacks belong in ghettos, why is it that people like you do the most to ensure they stay there?

It's pretty depressing that you actually believe that.

Fittisize
A Canadian who is so proud of his country, and he can't even spell his leader's name. Chreitien; Chreitein?

Actually, it's Chrétien.

But you might as well spell is 'Martin' from now on. (hopefully that'll change)

alien space marine
Actually, it's Chrétien.

But you might as well spell is 'Martin' from now on. (hopefully that'll change)
Ive seen alot of Magazines spell it the way I did so I am not the only fish.

Fittisize
Uh huh, well you musta read it wrong or else they spelt it wrong.

Moiraine
Uh huh, well you musta read it wrong or else they spelt it wrong.

You mean spelled ? :kiss:

Fittisize
Nope, I meant spelt. Either/or.

Moiraine
Nope, I meant spelt. Either/or.

But spelt is not a word...

N-Man
Yes it is.

Fittisize
Look it up.

DMiller
spell
v. spelled, or spelt (splt) spell·ing, spells
v. tr.
To name or write in order the letters constituting (a word or part of a word).

To constitute the letters of (a word): These letters spell animal.

To add up to; signify: Their unwise investment could spell financial ruin.

-iLluSiON-
I love how everyone is a perfectionist or at least tries to be one on this bored.

Moiraine
I love how everyone is a perfectionist or at least tries to be one on this bored.

My mistake Fitty. You were right and I was wrong! Sorry :flowers:

iLluSiON
http://www.nicksildesigns.com/forumpics/stfucoffe.jpg

Ryan
I love how everyone is a perfectionist or at least tries to be one on this bored.
You forgot the comma between 'perfectionist' and 'or'.

:)

DMiller
You also used the wrong "board."

Fittisize
I think it was supposed to be some sort of pun.

Ryan
I think it was supposed to be some sort of pun.
Moreso than you noticed, from the look of it.

-iLluSiON-
Moiraine: Grow some pubes before you know what's good for you. :finger:

Darunia
*Darunia-Weltall-Moiraine Alliance declares war on ILLUSION*

Moiraine
Moiraine: Grow some pubes before you know what's good for you. :finger:

:violin:
http://www.nicksildesigns.com/forumpics/looknewbie.jpg

alien space marine
:violin:
http://www.nicksildesigns.com/forumpics/looknewbie.jpg

Atleast I am not the butt end of this.

Darunia
*Darunia fields 350,000 troops, (43,000 cavalry), 1,100 pieces of artillery. Also summons Odolwa to his aid*

*The sky turns black, and Odolwa descends from the clouds. From nowhere, there is catchy, rythmic drum fanfare. Odolwa, clad in his colorful mezo-american paints, begins to dance around in circles; cutting off the ILLUSION plan for retreat*

*Odolwa joins the Goron-Weltall-Moiraine alliance*

Fittisize
Lay off the whole war thing, it's getting to a point where you are making yourself look like a homosexual.

Moiraine
Let him do what he wants..
Only get worried if you see him in his car in traffic sayin he declares war on the cars in front of him.

Great Rumbler
*Also declare war on Illusion*

A Black Falcon
Why am I not surprised that you didn't respond...

Ryan
Sorry, but I can only take so much of arguing the same points repeatedly before I lose interest.

Darunia
What we were arguing about here? I just wanted to get in on the action! In real life, though, ILLUSION really is this conceited. Makes it hard to get along with him sometimes; he has a superiority complex.

:mariowin: :luigiwin:

Geno
Lay off the whole war thing, it's getting to a point where you are making yourself look like a homosexual.

Darunia doing war RPs is like Darunia masturbating: only he enjoys it. :banana:

Darunia
People posting here more than a few times a week is like debating anime movies: Only enormously fucking losers do it.

Exceptions apply.

Great Rumbler
Anime movies are cool though. *succeeds in being labeled a loser* Woohoo! :mariowin:

Dark Jaguar
But Odolwa is WEAK! He like SO dies in 3 hits when I fight him now!

:banana: :luigiwin: :flowers: :shake: :idea: :what: :mariowin:

alien space marine
But Odolwa is WEAK! He like SO dies in 3 hits when I fight him now!

:banana: :luigiwin: :flowers: :shake: :idea: :what: :mariowin:

What have you done to my Moon thread?

Great Rumbler
It has become a desolate wasteland of the nonsensical. It happens to all threads...eventually.

A Black Falcon
Weltall, I agree it does get like that, but I didn't think it was so soon this time... :)

And GR, you are right anime movies are cool.

Ryan
Weltall, I agree it does get like that, but I didn't think it was so soon this time... :)
Well, the more we do it, the less new ground there is to argue.

-iLluSiON-
It's funny because Darunia is the only person who thinks I'm conceited. I'm never nice or sincere to him. All he does is declare war in real life too. This results in him having little to no friends whatsoever.

Makes it hard to get along with him sometimes; he has a superiority complex.

Only superior to losers like you.

(edit- a new treaty has been signed between darunia and ILLUSION)

Filmmaker1237
::calls in Middleboro troops::

Moiraine
::calls in Middleboro troops::

Yay a newbie
:cow:

Filmmaker1237
my family owns cows
::calls in mounted cow troops::

Moiraine
my family owns cows
::calls in mounted cow troops::

:erm: ok..

Filmmaker1237
but i thank you for the welcome, my friend :-)
moo

Darunia
All he does is declare war in real life too.

To you perhaps.

A Black Falcon
Huh, a newbie... they're a very rare species around here. :)

And Darunia... there's nothing wrong with being a geek. Admit it to yourself and you will be happier. :D

Moiraine
It's funny because Darunia is the only person who thinks I'm conceited. I'm never nice or sincere to him. All he does is declare war in real life too.
:chuckle:


Only superior to losers like you.
How many girlfriends have you had?
Had sex yet?

What does that have to do with someone bein a loser?

-iLluSiON-
And Darunia... there's nothing wrong with being a geek. Admit it to yourself and you will be happier. :D

*agrees*

In fact, I bet you Darunia is more of a geek than all of you combined.
we're all geeks. now let's party on the moon!
Oh wait, I can't. I'm pleasantly waiting his counter-attack.

Moiraine: Come here and give me a kiss!!! :kiss:

Moiraine
*agrees*

In fact, I bet you Darunia is more of a geek than all of you combined.
we're all geeks. now let's party on the moon!
Oh wait, I can't. I'm pleasantly waiting his counter-attack.

:drunk:

A Black Falcon
What does that have to do with someone bein a loser?

True those things are not bad.

Filmmaker1237
yeah patriots..ben you really should watch.....

Darunia
Illusion, you dumbass, they're going to believe everything you're saying.

A Black Falcon
We don't have to do that to know more than we wanted to know...

-iLluSiON-
Illusion, you dumbass, they're going to believe everything you're saying.

huh? are you being sarcastic, Darunia? DIDN'T WE JUST GO OVER THIS!?
don't be false.

:confused2

:topic:

How about that moon?

Filmmaker1237
cant we all just get along? :type:

-iLluSiON-
i'm trying to.. we've discussed this. hopef ully he will understand. :flowers:

Filmmaker1237
i hope so too :hump:

Darunia
Bush is OFFICIALLY going to unveil his new space program on CNN at 3:00pm. I'm going to watch it.



i'm trying to.. we've discussed this. hopef ully he will understand

How is it that my calling him "conceited" is the supreme evil in this, and his massively insulting rantings (so bad he himself deleted them) are all in good fun? "Hopefully he will understand"...eat me. Now you're pretending to be the angel of mercy.

alien space marine
Bush is OFFICIALLY going to unveil his new space program on CNN at 3:00pm. I'm going to watch it.





They should have done that a long time ago, After the Apollo program people were expecting by the time we reached 2000 we would have landed on mars, Instead we allowed Nasa to stagnate along with scientific education, and are only ambitions were spinning circuls around the earth. I hope this new Space race plan will go through.

Filmmaker1237
the patriots are one win away from going to the super bowl...they should hold it on the moon :zero:

Filmmaker1237
anyone here follow the nfl? :kiss:

-iLluSiON-
How is it that my calling him "conceited" is the supreme evil in this, and his massively insulting rantings (so bad he himself deleted them) are all in good fun? "Hopefully he will understand"...eat me. Now you're pretending to be the angel of mercy.

So you do believe in angels? Ahh, I knew it.
So you can stuff about someone and not expect to get any backfire in return? Is that how your system works, BEN? Everything you say on this page is a biased opinion that no one but yourself thinks. You are truly a moron in every sense. You pretended like you understood what I was telling you online and now you're trying to look like a righteous warrior and are starting shit again. You are really starting to get nervewracking.

(so bad he himself deleted them)
Because they were the truth and you were "embarrassed" online.

Sacred Jellybean
ILLUSION really is this conceited. Makes it hard to get along with him sometimes; he has a superiority complex.

People posting here more than a few times a week is like debating anime movies: Only enormously fucking losers do it.

Tee-hee... irony.

Filmmaker1237
yea signature!

-iLluSiON-
Tee-hee... irony.


THANK YOU! FINALLY!
YOU ARE THE SACRED JELLYBEAN!!

if you ask me, there is no more stubborn person on the page. Why do you think war is always being declared?? :barf:

Filmmaker1237
the triumvirate of middleboro is crumbling...for those that dont know, illusion, darunia and myself know each other in person..thats how we came to be on here, if you take my meaning....and, if theres a bright center to the universe..im sorry, i just feel like talking, i have nothing to say as of yet

Filmmaker1237
Does anyone know how I change that part of my thingy where it says "Tendite?" :topic:

Filmmaker1237
Ben (Darunia)-
You have friends. You have knowledge. You're a good looking kid, and people like you. You need to stop obsessing, stop living in the past, stop blaming things on others. Do something to make yourself happy, start living, start meeting new people....just stop being stubborn and negative and enjoy life. Whatever happened in the past with Victory and Ashley and Rachel are history. I've put Mandi behind me and Doyle (Illusion) has put Ashley behind him. Sure, we miss them, but thats life. You don't have to be so angry and negative and stubborn. here are people that want to help you, that like it when they see you happy, and me and Doyle are two of them. We're just trying to help, and I hope you can take some advice and let us help you. We're your friends, and we're here for you. :-)

A Black Falcon
There is a button. It is called "edit". It means you don't need to make three posts in a row.

Also, there are other threads, I think, where the subject is football... sports certainly.

And finally your title can be changed in your User CP of course. :)

Filmmaker1237
Thanks :-)...but my last post is most important, as for sports..a sox fn i see, i am one too

Darunia
Filmmaker1237: This is an online forum, not a love letter.

My anti-anime line was against my long-time enemies at TC, not at Illusion. His brown-nosed "THANK YOU! FINALLY! YOU ARE THE SACRED JELLYBEAN!!" is purely motivated by a desire to humiliate me. The enemy of my enemy is my friend; so it is with him.

if you ask me, there is no more stubborn person on the page. Why do you think war is always being declared??

Forgive me, I didn't know war (fake or real) was the signature of stubborness. That lousy, stubborn FDR; stubborn bastard, he he hadn't been so stubborn and declared war on Japan, well, WWII wouldn't have happened! And that stubborn Continental Congress, those stubborn stubborners! If they hadn't been so STUBBORN, we'd be tantamount to Canada today: the Queen's puppy.

-iLluSiON-
Forgive me, I didn't know war (fake or real) was the signature of stubborness. That lousy, stubborn FDR; stubborn bastard, he he hadn't been so stubborn and declared war on Japan, well, WWII wouldn't have happened! And that stubborn Continental Congress, those stubborn stubborners! If they hadn't been so STUBBORN, we'd be tantamount to Canada today: the Queen's puppy.

okay Darunia. You really are insane. Stop living in a fantasy world. :rolleyes:

Anyway, this topic has reached 4 pages, I say we put an end to this nonsense.

Filmmaker1237
I found the User CP, but I cant find the place to change my title, and how the hell do I change my avatar?

Filmmaker1237
Why dont we talk about something productive...

Moiraine
I found the User CP, but I cant find the place to change my title, and how the hell do I change my avatar?

I dunno bout the title under your name, because when I looked I could not see where you could change it but I could be wrong..
As for the picture, go to User CP and go to where it says Change Avatar.

Filmmaker1237
but it has a button clicked that says "no avatar" and it wont change..:-\

Filmmaker1237
haha, family guy
LOIS: Peter, do you even know which one of our children I'm talking about?'
PETER: Uhhh...Gordon?

A Black Falcon
The User CP has all kinds of stuff. :)

Look in the Options page. It's there, right above the areas for the info in your profile and your birthdate (so that it'll display on the main page when it's your birthday). 'Custom User Title'.

Avatars. Use, obviously, 'Custom Avatar'. Check the 'Use Custom Avatar' box. And then put either the URL to the avatar (in the upper box) or the location on your hard drive (for upload to the TC server) of the avatar (observing size limitations). And hit Save.

Great Rumbler
On some forums you have to have a certain amount of posts before you can have a custom avatar.

alien space marine
On some forums you have to have a certain amount of posts before you can have a custom avatar.

I am also having problems with my avitar options , Like I have posted in ramble city , It seems that only admins have the option of changing Avitars.

A Black Falcon
I don't think that's the case here. I think it might be admins-only in vBulletin 3... I'll see what I can find.

Darunia
I liked the TC we had last week to this one. By a significant margin.

A Black Falcon
You mean vBulletin 2?

Darunia
Whatever the technical name, It was the one we've had since forever before this red one.

A Black Falcon
But this one added all kinds of cool features... the only thing I really miss is the better smilie box. This one's awful.

Oh, and that page of useless text after the message box on the post screen is really annoying... but Quick Reply helps with that. :)

Great Rumbler
vBulletin 3 has user groups!