Nintendo and Silicon Knights part??

What the hell??!


April 13, 2022 - IGNcube today learned that Canada-based development studio Silicon Knights has ended its second-party status with Nintendo Co. Ltd. The company will effective immediately be allowed to develop software for multiple consoles including Microsoft's Xbox and Sony's PlayStation platforms.

Though no official reason was given for the decision, IGNcube speculates that the philosophies of the two companies did not mesh. Silicon Knights has always been a very content-driven studio with strong beliefs in the elements of game creation including content, artistry, sound, and technology. Nintendo has recently downplayed the role of technology in game creation and has been known to de-emphasize compelling story, graphics and sound in favor of classic play mechanics.
"Silicon Knights and Nintendo have agreed to mutually part ways," Silicon Knights' President Denis Dyack told IGNcube.

"Nintendo and Silicon Knights have reached an agreement allowing Silicon Knights to pursue its vision of videogame entertainment with other companies," said a Nintendo of America spokesperson. "Nintendo respects the creative work of Silicon Knights and the parties have left the door open to work on future projects that meet the creative vision of both companies."

Asked if today's news meant Silicon Knights would not continue to develop for Nintendo platforms, Denis Dyack said: "No it doesn't. It's possible that we may do another game with Nintendo, actually. It just means that we've decided to break our exclusivity with Nintendo."

Dyack confirmed that Silicon Knights is now fully able to develop for competing consoles as well.

An official announcement from Nintendo is expected in the coming weeks.

-- Matt Casamassina


source: IGN (http://xbox.ign.com/articles/506/506194p1.html)

Talk about a complete surprise and major dissapointment! Denis Dyack always talks about how much he loves working for Nintendo and how much better SK has been under their guidance and how he wants to work with Miyamoto for a very long time. What could have caused this? The poor sales of both of their GC titles and Nintendo's complete lack of marketing push for Twin Snakes? That has to be it. Their games sell like crap on Nintendo consoles, simple as that.

Fuck, this is terrible news.

First Rare, then Leftfield, now Silicon Knights. Who's next?

:yipes:

Wait a second! *checks calendar* NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

I know, at first I thought it was a really late April Fool's joke.

So... this means Twin Snakes is eventually going to get ported to other systems.... doesn't it.

*finally regains composure*

Well, guys, this is it. I no longer have ANY faith in Nintendo to make sound business decisions anymore. With the Gamecube we thought that Nintendo was finally beginning to change to fight back, however this proves what we knew all along, but didn't want to admit, that Nintendo is NOT changing and because of this they are destroying themselves. And I'm the optimist here!!

If they can bust out with a huge E3 showing and the DS becomes a big hit then I might be able to regain some of my faith for Nintendo's future.

So... this means Twin Snakes is eventually going to get ported to other systems.... doesn't it.

Mmm, I don't know. That depends on how much Nintendo themselves helped with the development or who owns the rights to it.

*finally regains composure*

Well, guys, this is it. I no longer have ANY faith in Nintendo to make sound business decisions anymore. With the Gamecube we thought that Nintendo was finally beginning to change to fight back, however this proves what we knew all along, but didn't want to admit, that Nintendo is NOT changing and because of this they are destroying themselves. And I'm the optimist here!!

If they can bust out with a huge E3 showing and the DS becomes a big hit then I might be able to regain some of my faith for Nintendo's future.

Yeah I agree with you there. Nintendo acquired Silicon Knights in order to attract older gamers to the Gamecube, and while they did a piss-poor job of it by giving their games little (ED) to zero (TS) marketing push now their big mature game developer is no longer exclusive. Fucking brilliant, Nintendo.

Denis Dyack loved working under Nintendo and seemed like a little boy working with Santa Clause in all of his interviews. The only reason I can think of for this breakup is that either a) SK got sick of their games selling so poorly on Nintendo's console and didn't like Nintendo's stance on "good story, good graphics = bad"; b) Nintendo wasn't happy with the sales of SK's games and decided to dump them; or c) a combination of the two. Personally I'm leaning towards b.

What is Nintendo going to do now? Currently Retro is their only developer who is making games with the older crowd in mind, and they can only pump out maybe one game every two years or so. That is not enough. Third party exclusives are a good start, but there isn't enough of that. The combination of third-party exclusives like RE4, Silicon Knights' games, and Retro's games was beginning to make for a pretty nice combination. Now it has fallen apart.

Microsoft shall buy them out!

Microsoft shall buy them out!

They probably will.

:shiggy2: MS makes GOOD business decisions though. The average person doesn't think "must buy" with SK like they did with Rare. They think "who?". I doubt MS would buy out a company that's only made a few games, none of them really big hits. Right Bungie?

Denis Dyack was awesome. With that in mind I just have one thing to say: Stay awesome, Denis Dyack. Stay awesome.

Well, we still have n-Space for older games too. :muddled:

Did Nintendo even really own Silicon Knights ? Or was it just kind of a publishing deal that was up for renewal and Nintendo decided not to renew ?

Its really odd that one day Iwata says they're trying to appeal to all ranges of gamer ages, and the next day they dump one of their "mature" subject developers.

SK was an official second-party, I believe, so they owned a portion of them.

And DJ, SK is still a talented developer whose games could sell well if given enough marketing support and on a console with an older demographic.

Perhaps the problem with Nintendo holding onto SK was similar to RARE, in that it might have been an issue of efficiency ? Didn't SK only produce 2 games for the GC to date ?

If thats the case, whatever it is, I think Nintendo is in the process of cleaning house, and whatever it is, I think we can at least have faith in Nintendo that through all this so called "trouble" they can still come out to be the most profitable game company. It means their business is well upkept.

I haven't been keeping up, but has RARE put out games for MS yet ? Or are they still kind of being a "burden" on them ?

Rare has released one (not so great) game for the X-Box, but MS bought them mainly for the X-Box 2 and beyond.

SK hasn't been with Nintendo for very long so it can't be a matter of efficiency. I still don't know what the problem was since Dyack made it very clear that SK was a part of Nintendo and that they were never going to leave them. Perhaps Nintendo cut them loose because of the poor sales of ED and TS (even though that was Nintendo's fault) or SK wanted to leave because they didn't like the direction Nintendo was heading.

In all fairness, why didn't Konami advertise TS?

Also, this says nothing about how well either game was advertised in Japan.

Even then, Nintendo Power actually gave Metal Gear full coverage and previews too, so its not as if Nintendo didn't make it known within their own network.

Nintendo Power doesn't matter to anyone ever. :D

Seriously, it doesn't.

Honestly, anyone who has Nintendo Power is the sort of person who totally ALREADY KNEW Twin Snakes was coming.

but konami published TS and should have advertised it. it isn't a nintendo game, so it's not their fault for not advertising.

this is terrible news, maybe it's somehow not true...bah. microsoft IS going to buy them, just because that would make me want to punch myself in the balls out of frustration and the world seems to like to see me do that to myself.

the world seems to like to see me do that to myself.

big guy is onto something...!

Punch yourself in the balls. Do it! Now!

Twin Snakes got plenty of ads in Japan (they even made a series of commercials there, while we got NO commercials whatsoever), so I don't know why Konami or Nintendo didn't do anything about it here. True Konami was the publisher, but Nintendo co-developed the game and should have done something.

I've been reading a lot of theories on this sudden break-up and none of them really make any sense. Matt from ign suggested that it might have been an issue of creative differences and SK might have wanted more freedom, and while I considered that for a little while I don't believe it. Miyamoto made it very clear that they were allowing SK the freedom that they wanted. They didn't force TS upon them, it was offered. And while Nintendo has been saying that graphics and presentation are not important, games like WW and Metroid Prime prove that it doesn't affect all of Nintendo. Eiji Aunoma places great importance on storytelling, which is why Wind Waker had such a strong story compared to all of the other Zelda games. It also had a wonderful graphics engine and a terrific presentation. Metroid Prime, while not having a great story, also had great graphics and presentation and word has it that Prime 2 will have a deep story. You can see Nintendo's supposed philosophy in games like Mario Sunshine, Pikmin, and Pacman Vs., but it doesn't seem as though this is preventing all of their second and first-parties from going all out with what Nintendo says is unimportant.

Considering the date this was announced I have to wonder...could this all be a ploy to get alot of people talking about SK? Then at e3 ED2 is revieled and Denis says "It was an Insanity effect!"

...interesting...

Anyway, how well did TS sell in Japan?

I dunno, it hasn't been on any of the March Japanese charts at magic box.

... this is bad...

And yes, it just doesn't seem to make sense. Bizarre.

Then at e3 ED2 is revieled and Denis says "It was an Insanity effect!"

You know...Dyack might just be crazy enough to do something like that.

If only that were the case.

Doubtful though...

Still...we can delude ourselves into thinking it's the case.

And more likely be dissapointed...

This doesn't mean that SK will drop Nintendo. They'll simply release games on all systems which means big bucks... if the developer can handle it. And SK made enough money with Eternal Darkness and Twin Snakes to up their production resources.

If Sony or MS buys them out that won't happen.

Which one of them might well do.

They would only do that if their resources weren't up to their own standards. They just got out of an exclusivity with Nintendo. They want to carry their own weight for a while, atleast one or two games multi console. Then they'll see where they go from there.

i like the insanity effect idea...i'm gonna believe it, even if to do so is insane

blaims it on the Jews :D

huh...

What?

http://www.gamespot.com/news/2004/04/13/news_6093427.html

Less positive than the news from Factor 5, I'd say. Though who knows...

who blames it on the jews?

Perhaps ASM meant it as an action, ie "I am blaiming it on the jews", and a hilarious anti-semitic joke.

oh...

...huh...

Which still wouldn't make it any more witty or logical.

I blame the Polish and Dutch for kippered snacks.

I blame the Jews for being so adorable. Have you ever seen a rabbi you can stay mad at? Look at that hair. That's hair you cant be mad at. The curly hair, the little hat, it's like a little hairy kitten that's just got a makeover. They're adorable, look at the way they talk! For shizzle my nizzle. They even have thousands of years of persecution and Hanukkah Bushes! Like a Christmas TREE except it's a BUSH, even their holidays are adorable! Except for the blood on the door, but I heard they use beets now. They're so adorable that if it wasn't offensive to the Jewish people I would own one as a pet along with a Chinese baby. So yes, it's true, they're adorable, and I blame them for being that way.

Alien Space Marine, you have hit the proverbial nail on the head!

And Optimus Prime is Jewish!

I might have some Jewish blood... I have a German great-aunt who might have been Jewish. :dunno:

I may also have some jewish blood, My great grand father was a Jew.
Dont tell Hitler!

Yeah... cause then he'll get you!

Hitler's gonna get ya!!

I may also have some jewish blood, My great grand father was a Jew.
Dont tell Hitler!

I'm part German. Don't tell the Jews!!

GASP!


... but there are lots of German Jews...

Remember the other day when I told you that the definition of irony is...AAAAGGHHH!!! *is attacked by a squid*

I love fried squid.

How is a squid ironic?

Basketball playing dwarves: It's not; hence the irony.

Oh...

How is a squid ironic?

It was from the New Years 2000 episode of Family Guy.

Peter Griffin: Hey that nice chicken outside gave me this coupon.

Register Biscuit: I'm sorry this coupon is expired.

Peter: *turns around to see giant chicken* Why you son of a-

*smashes through window and gets into fisty cuffs with large chicken, and pecking is involved*

*chicken throws sand in Peter's face and runs off*

*Peter chases chicken to BRIDGE FIGHT SCENE!*

*fight goes on with many punches and the whole "fighting while hanging over guard rail" thing happens*

*Chicken drops down and escapes on back of truck, and while waving and smiling, suddenly turns around to see Peter on OTHER bridge ahead, somehow, and he jumps on and fight continues, ON A TRUCK... ACTION!... WOW! BE AMAZED DANGIT!*

*Chicken fight continues and helicopter with ladder thrown out flies by, and they both climb the ladder and continue fighting, and then an office scene*

Worker 1: I'm going to need these copied and faxed by Friday.

Worker 2: Ooo is that going to give us enough time to colate the-

*fight smashes in through window in sky scraper and interupts conversation between people that are DESIGNED TO BE HATED*

*Peter destroys a few walls... somehow, and knocks chicken into copy machine, where the chicken's head is smashed with the lid and the copier shows copies of the head in proceeding states of bludgeon*

*Peter walks away*

Peter: Chicken... gave me a bad coupo-

*Chicken smashes through wall and tackles Peter through another window down to the ground, where the chicken is stabbed with glass while Peter lands safely on Chicken, and he gets up and walks into the sunset while sad piano music plays meant to convince you, YOU, that this was a moving emotional story somehow*

Yes, oh YES! I am ALL about Peter Griffin over here!

How this goes from Jews to squids and then chickens is beyond me?

The power of Tendo City.

It's power of TC to completely change the topic of thread until you can no longer recognize it. It's often refered to as the "Off-Topic Insanity Effect*.

Now, see... This is... this is what I call... hypocrisy.

Let's all go to Brazil and watch children sniff glue.

Okay.

Those inuit kids like too sniff gasoline untill they get brain damage.

Who doesn't?

Let's play everyone's favorite therapist game; Word association!

Someone posts a word (or noun), and the next person who posts, writes the first word (or noun) they think of after reading the first word. Confused? Good! I'll start!

Feelings

Someone posted this at the ign boards and I'm actually starting to believe in GR's idea that this is just one big marketing ploy for ED2.

As your all probably well aware, rumors are circulating about the SK/GCN breakup being just a Marketing Ploy for an announcment of Eternal Darkness 2. After going through information, heres what I have come up with:

1) Dennis Dyack has stated the relationship between Nitendo and SK is/was very, very strong.

2) This announcment was completly out of the blue. Not the SLIGHTEST warnings at all.

3) IGN are the only people to have "offically" reported it. They are VERY close to Dennis Dyack.

4) Planet GameCube, also claiming to have contacted Dyack about this, posted the news at 3:33pm.

5) This news was announced April 13th. The E3 press conference ends May 13th.

6) Including the day of the announcment (April 13th) and the day after the end of E3 (May 15th) you have a total of 33 days.

7) Dyack has stated that if he hints towards there next game, ala: MGS, it will be in a much more tricky and sneaky method than he did last time, as people will be prepared.

8) There has still be NO official announcment. When Rare departed there Nintendo announced it (including press release) the day we knew or the day after.

9) Dyack has said there is much more to the Eternal Darkness story, and that one day he would like to show it.

Just a quick note to those in the dark: In the SK game Eternal Darkness the number 333 had a special, mysterious meaning to all the crazyness that was going on.

Am scraping the bottom of the barrel? Yes, definately. Is some of the stuff here pretty far fetched? Obviously yes, it is.

But you cant deny some of them seem "fishy". Noteably the fact there has been NO proper official announcment and that PlanetGamecube posted the article at 3:33.

Man, if this really is true then Nintendo and Silicon Knights have pulled the greatest prank in the history of video games. I still think the part is true, but this gives me a glimmer of hope.

Anything that gives us hope, I guess... but I don't want to be let down either...

I'm not totally convinced that it's a hoax, but the breakup still doesn't make any sense. Just a month ago Dyack said that SK WAS Nintendo and that they would never go anywhere.

ED didn't sell very well, and what better way to raise awareness for its sequel than to put them on the front page of every gaming site and magazine? It's a genius plan if true.

Honestly I don't look into numbers for "proof". Far as I can tell, this only means SK has the rights to make their games for whatever company they want now. It doesn't mean they can't make games for Nintendo. More importantly, it also doesn't mean Miyamoto won't work with them in the future. It's still very possible, even after this VERY friendly "breakup", that Nintendo and SK could work on an exclusive GCN title.

Dyack said very clearly that SK would always be a part of Nintendo. He said this a month ago. Surely if the breakup is real he would have known about it more than a month in advance! So either Dyack is a rotten liar or he's playing a huge prank on us.

But if ED was the cause it wouldn't be years later they leave... its poor sales didn't do this. MGS:TT? I don't know... but why would poor sales get the team dumped? That doesn't sound like Nintendo, really... I'd expect it for game quality, or something like that (Rare? Uhh... not enough production for the Cube? One game...), but sales? There must be a better reason.

Yeah, and we've gotten NO official word from Nintendo yet. Very fishy...

You're right, the lack of an official announcement is odd. But we'll have to wait and see...

I'm crossing my fingers.

It's either all leading up to E3 to be showcased as the hoax, or there will be an official comment from Nintendo in the pre E3 meetings.

Regardless of anything that Nintendo or SK is doing, Eternal Darkness had a sequel planned during the production of the first game and has been working on Too Human for years, which will see the light of day, at the very least, on one of the consoles.

Factor 5 made an announcement they're working on next gen consoles and not any current gen. The only consoles they ever worked on, to my knowledge, were Nintendo consoles.

Nintendo made official comments about the N5 and that it will focus less on graphics prowess while at the same time, Nintendo has been tracked buying up some major chip and hardware manufacturers; Not to mention the huge collaborations going in to the DS and it's promised (yet unknown) capabilities with the N5.

Nintendo is planning on showing huge titles at E3. Most likely, the last huge titles we'll see for the Gamecube as 3rd parties will probably float the system in to its retirement. Which wont be pretty since the GC has little 3rd party support (if you dont count the second parties).

If Nintendo wants to show the DS - Nintendo will have to show it's capabilities with the N5.

I'm going to bet one American dollar that Nintendo will unveil, atleast partly, the next Nintendo console along with it's little pal the DS while showcasing the last first and second party GC titles. As far as the future of Silicon Knights with Nintendo, well... if they leave, may the rats eat their eyes.

If SK leaves Nintendo then it's most likely not their fault, it's Nintendo's. So may the rats eat their eyes.

Factor 5 made an announcement they're working on next gen consoles and not any current gen. The only consoles they ever worked on, to my knowledge, were Nintendo consoles.

Since Rogue Squadron, anyway. Well, depending on if you call the PC a console... they said in that article that their last non-Nintendo game had been the PC version of Rogue Squadron. And in early years they made games for Amiga... I don't know about the other-console versions of Turrican, though. I don't think they made them, but I'm not sure.

If SK leaves Nintendo then it's most likely not their fault, it's Nintendo's. So may the rats eat their eyes.

Yes.

They developed the Genesis, Amiga (which got three Turrican titles), and Turbo Grafx Turrican games. They also developed BallBlazer Champions for the PSX.

I think Nintendo's planning on dropping the biggest, most exciting, most coolest, most BOJACKSOME E3 showing EVER.


...


But what do I know?! I'm just the resident optimist!!! *sulks in a corner*

*walks over to Johnny sitting in his corner, gives him a lollipop.*

They developed the Genesis, Amiga (which got three Turrican titles), and Turbo Grafx Turrican games. They also developed BallBlazer Champions for the PSX.

I knew they did the Amiga ones (they were the originals, right?). Just wasn't sure about the Genesis game...

Oh, and they did that PSX game? I knew it's a game that Lucasarts published, but don't know much about it beyond that...

*walks over to Johnny sitting in his corner, gives him a lollipop.*


Yay!

Matt Camassassinasina says the SK news is real.

Hey, why did Nintendo not officially announce the SK Breakup? Like they did with Left Field and Rare? There are rumors that the whole breakup is fake to eventually announce ED 2.

Matt responds: Buh? I saw some of these crazy theories on a few of the message boards and my only reaction is to reiterate that the news we reported is entirely true. Silicon Knights and Nintendo have ended their exclusive second-party relationship and the developer of Eternal Darkness will make games for other platforms. Both the president of Silicon Knights Denis Dyack and a completely official response from Nintendo have confirmed this fact.

So why didn't Nintendo announce it officially? No idea. Perhaps the finer details are still being negotiated and therefore the company is waiting on a release. Or maybe it just wanted to quietly slip that little doozey out during the truckload of news at the Electronics Entertainment Expo 2004. I'm not sure. But I am sure that the story is true and that Nintendo will eventually acknowledge it with its own "official" release.



:(

Hey... maybe he's also being tricked?

...


Ah fuck it.

:(

Hey... maybe he's also being tricked?

He's saying that because he's in on the joke. Duh.

I wish. :cry:

if i was matt cassamassina and i talked to denis dyack as much as he does i'd say "you march your cute little butt over to nintendo and you tell then that you will not become a third party who will then be bought out by microsoft." and then denis would say "matt, for you, anything." and then all of us here at tendo city would go like this "YaY!" and :far-out: :far-out: :far-out:

oh yeah...and i think that either matt cassimass is in on it or he's not in on it at all...stupid matt...

They broke off this sort of thing because they wanted full freedom. Companies CAN choose whether or not to be bought out.

Yes, and it would make perfect sense if it were any other company. But just two months ago Denis sounded very firm in his commitment with Nintendo and flat-out said that they are Nintendo. I have a hard time believing that he was lying to us this whole time. So either this news is fake, or Nintendo let SK go with very little advance notice.

And I doubt Nintendo would do something like that unless they're really stupid.

...


...


Yeah yeah, I know.

:(

Something I think that's odd is the fact that there were absolutely no rumors going around before the news came up. With Rare the rumor was going around for months, of course they are RARE and they were being bought, but it's still a valid point and another oddity that comes together to create an interesting tapestry.

Why would there be rumors? It's a really REALLY bad idea to think every single thing that's real should have rumors about it beforehand. Recently a lot of announcements have come completely out of the blue with no warning at all. I'm tempted to count the DS as one of them, but I don't browse EVERY message board (I'm talking about it's existance, not the rumors that came AFTER it was announced).

Stop ruining my optimism!!

Yeah but the DS announcement doesn't defy all logic and reason like this SK one does.

What's so illogical about it anyway? I think you started kinda believing it, and then you sorta got sucked into it so much you started truly believing the stuff that only KINDA made sense to you before. It's a cycle of sorts.

Nope, to us outside this whole rumor, it's still very sound. SK and Nintendo are still on good terms. They both said they still want to work together in the future. In essence, this didn't hurt their relationship at all, it just freed up the company to do other things as well. Nintendo didn't "fire" SK, or say "go away we don't like you any more".

For that matter, of all the ways they could have gone about this sort of thing, for the sake of a sanity effect, this one seems the most obscure. Maybe it's for subtlety, but still it's kinda pointless.

For THAT matter, where's the proof? Even if you prove them becoming 3rd party is just a rumor, you still gotta provide SOMETHING beyond pure conjecture that they are actually pulling some weird prank.

What's so illogical about it anyway? I think you started kinda believing it, and then you sorta got sucked into it so much you started truly believing the stuff that only KINDA made sense to you before. It's a cycle of sorts.

Nope, to us outside this whole rumor, it's still very sound. SK and Nintendo are still on good terms. They both said they still want to work together in the future. In essence, this didn't hurt their relationship at all, it just freed up the company to do other things as well. Nintendo didn't "fire" SK, or say "go away we don't like you any more".

For that matter, of all the ways they could have gone about this sort of thing, for the sake of a sanity effect, this one seems the most obscure. Maybe it's for subtlety, but still it's kinda pointless.

For THAT matter, where's the proof? Even if you prove them becoming 3rd party is just a rumor, you still gotta provide SOMETHING beyond pure conjecture that they are actually pulling some weird prank.
Well if you looked at the facts that I posted, it did seem pretty damn convincing. However after Matt's recent comments I'm forced to believe that it's not a hoax.
And have you payed attention to this thread at all? This whole breakup makes very little sense. Like I mentioned several times already, just a couple of months ago Denis Dyack said very plainly that SK was Nintendo and were never going to go anywhere, and that many other companies asked SK if they could make games for their systems and they said "no, we are Nintendo". Why would he say that if they were about to break up?

It's crazy.

...

Why can't E3 get here sooner?!

SK and Nintendo are still on good terms. They both said they still want to work together in the future.

Unless the parting was truly awful (and public!), you ALWAYS say this... it means nothing to me.

Well if you looked at the facts that I posted, it did seem pretty damn convincing. However after Matt's recent comments I'm forced to believe that it's not a hoax.
And have you payed attention to this thread at all? This whole breakup makes very little sense. Like I mentioned several times already, just a couple of months ago Denis Dyack said very plainly that SK was Nintendo and were never going to go anywhere, and that many other companies asked SK if they could make games for their systems and they said "no, we are Nintendo". Why would he say that if they were about to break up?

Yeah, the lack of sense is the biggest problem here. I just don't see anything that could have split them up so quickly! I don't see any issue here that drove them apart, like you can do with Left Field or Rare... it's frusterating!