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Mon, May 1st, 2006   #1
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Default ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION !!

Illegal immigration has come to the limelight recently in the news. Liberals try to mask these criminals as "undocumented immigrants". Some cry for amnesty. Others for deportation. The politicians don't want anything to do with it and cannot act on the topic.

The fact is that illegals are here ILLEGALLY. That alone irrefutably makes them all criminals, period.

Most, lacking SSNs, do not pay taxes, and take under-the-counter-paying jobs.

That doesn't keep them from receiving free education, welfare, hospital care, and a wide variety of other benefits that come from out of the purses of we tax-paying, LEGAL citizens.

Their refusal (or inability?) to learn OUR language upon coming (illegally) to our country leads us to condescend to their level by translating everything into THEIR language FOR THEM.

i.e. Spanish.

What message does this send to the hard-working, decent, respectable immigrants who come to this country the RIGHT way?



Nobody has a problem with immigrants who come here legally. I do not have a problem with immigrants who come from any nation, or speak any language, or have any religion. BUT by damn, when you come to MY country, you learn MY language, adopt MY customs, and you assimilate!

Or you leave.


Thats the Goron position on this topic.

What is yours?
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Mon, May 1st, 2006   #2
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They're here illegally. It's really not that hard to understand.

Let's build a fence or put the national guard on the border to keep people from coming across. If they want to come here then they can go through the same process as all the other people do. And I think that if you're going to come to America you need to know how to speak English.
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Mon, May 1st, 2006   #3
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Illegal immigration has come to the limelight recently in the news. Liberals try to mask these criminals as "undocumented immigrants". Some cry for amnesty. Others for deportation. The politicians don't want anything to do with it and cannot act on the topic.

Liberals? It looks to me like this is a fairly bipartizan issue... note that the President, Mr. Radical Right, is pro-guest workers and isn't exactly a fan of the fence or really-tough-borders ideas...
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Let's build a fence or put the national guard on the border to keep people from coming across. If they want to come here then they can go through the same process as all the other people do. And I think that if you're going to come to America you need to know how to speak English.

Fences just plain won't work. The only way to keep them from coming is to have conditions in their countries be good enough that they don't want to come anymore... that's how Western Europe got the Eastern Europeans to stop leaving for the West -- they spent a lot of money to improve standards in those nations. Maybe just money isn't the answer, but the solution to the issue is in Mexico more than it is here, and we should be doing something of some kind.
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Mon, May 1st, 2006   #4
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The only way to keep them from coming is to have conditions in their countries be good enough that they don't want to come anymore...

Well, good luck with that.
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Mon, May 1st, 2006   #5
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Do you really think it's feasible to kick out every illegal immigrant? I had a number of students out today who were probably at the rally in Chicago, and I am pretty sure one of them is an illegal immigrant, although she speaks perfect English. For the most parts the immigrants aren't here to better their own lives, they are here to better the lives of their children. Saying that they don't pay taxes, get a free education, etc. doesn't hold water because they are paid well below minimum wage. Some of the businesses they work at might not be in business without them. Regardless, I do think we should do something, and I think we should give the illegal immigrants the opportunity to earn their citizenship the way normal immigrants do. If they don't want to do that then we can kick them out. It really is impossible to kick millions of people out of the country so we need to have some other way to fix this problem.
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Mon, May 1st, 2006   #6
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I think we should just annex all of Mexico and be done with it.
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Mon, May 1st, 2006   #7
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But then we'll be getting the illegal immigrants from Guatemala. We should just annex all of Central and South America so all we'll have to worry about is illegal penguins from the South Pole.
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Mon, May 1st, 2006   #8
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Let's just go ahead an annex the whole world. United States of the World. Yeah.
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Mon, May 1st, 2006   #9
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Annexation...

Wouldn't solve the problem. Rich nations annexing poor ones isn't always a great idea... the standard example is when West Germany merged with East Germany. The Eastern part is STILL vastly disadvantaged in comparison, and a lot of people moved from there to the West... this is why South Korea doesn't want to just assimilate North Korea right now, even if they could...
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Well, good luck with that.

It's certainly not easy, but as I said, it's the only thing that would work...
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Regardless, I do think we should do something, and I think we should give the illegal immigrants the opportunity to earn their citizenship the way normal immigrants do. If they don't want to do that then we can kick them out. It really is impossible to kick millions of people out of the country so we need to have some other way to fix this problem.

Yeah, I'm not sure exactly what should be done... on the one hand, we can't kick them out, but on the other hand, make some policy that makes it too easy for illegal immigrants to become citizens and we get flooded even more with them... yet they're only doing it because life here is so much better than at home. So it seems that a combonation of aid or something to improve conditions in Mexico and maybe also Central America (though Mexico is the key) and something that allows foreign workers to be here legally (guest worker program? A path to legality that involves paying back taxes, being considered after legal applicants, etc? I don't know)...

Really, this debate is a very interesting one. In many other first world nations we would not have this debate. There would be a debate, yes, but it'd be about if we should have any immigration at all -- not legal vs. illegal, but the relative qualities of maintaining racial purity versus increasing a static or declining population that needs workers... and in a lot of countries (most Western European nations, Japan, South Korea, etc), they've decided that in favor of the racial/national purity argument, whether or not that means that their population will drop because of low birthrates. But in America it's different, and we believe that immigration is good... but as usual, the latest immigrant group is disliked (Irish in the late 1800s, etc). That'll change with time...

As for language, just remember this: Do you know why America has no national language? It's because of the Pennsylvania Germans, who in the late 1700s spoke German and not English and did not want to be forced to speak English. Over time they learned it, however, and became American while retaining some elements of their heritage. There is no reason why not to expect why Hispanics won't follow that same path. Well, there is one stumbling block, which is how many of them are illegal and thus cannot interact with normal American society like normal immigrants should, but illegal immigration is something we have to get a handle on, so eventually that should change... you can never get rid of all of it, but I'm sure we'll do something to help with the problem, with how big of an issue it is right now.
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Tue, May 2nd, 2006   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darunia
Nobody has a problem with immigrants who come here legally. I do not have a problem with immigrants who come from any nation, or speak any language, or have any religion. BUT by damn, when you come to MY country, you learn MY language, adopt MY customs, and you assimilate!

Thems some true American ideals there! The founding fathers are spinning in their graves.

We have kind of shot ourselves in the foot though. Now that we DO translate every word in existence in this country, those who speak those languages have little incentive to learn our language which is, actually, an extremely difficul language to learn. Sure, the basics are as hard as any other language, but ours has so many nuances, slang terms, and other such alterations that it's hard for those new to the language to keep up.

Not that I'm saying they shouldn't speak our language. Far as I'm concerned, the whole world should just speak English and we'd be done with it. I mean really. Who speaks SWAHILI?
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Tue, May 2nd, 2006   #11
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I just do not understand. It's not like you cant become a united states citizen through the proper channels and paperwork. you end up paying around 300 bucks in total after its all said and done and there's even translators available if you dont speak english. My thing is if you're going to live in another country number 1, do it the right way and number 2, do not expect that country to cater to your needs.

"I was told that in America the streets are paved with gold... but when I arrived i saw that there were no streets and I was the one who was going to pave them." ~irish immigrant, 1913

if you cant speak english you're extremely limited, it would be on the same level as saying you cant read or write (unless you live in a heavy spanish/mexican area or are dealing with nationwide firms who cater to spanish), but as far as getting a real job or a career it's not going to happen (legally anyways). They're putting themselves in horrible situations for no reason and degrading the quality of life in the united states for everyone on multiple levels, like it or not.

This country was built on immigrants, we're ALL immigrants (unless you're native american ) so i have no 'problem' or 'issue' at all with anyone who wants to live in this country as long as you're not a fucking muslim, just do it properly and legally. I dont understand why that's so hard. It's a pain in the ass, sure. but my wife is an american citizen now, it took about 2 years (and she was allowed to live and work here with a SNN for that duration). So why cant the mexicans, puerto ricans, etc follow the same path? I think it's because they WANT to live 'free' without having a SSN, or taxes, or any records of their birth. Hell, you could end up making your own birth certificate, get an ID with a fake name, do whatever you want... get too many DUI's under your fake driver's liscense - make a new birth certificate; absoltely no respect for the laws or inner workings of the country, (ovbiously anyone can do that, but an illegal immigrant is forced in to that situation) they can do anything... except learn english and pay taxes and try to make your new country a better place to live (as cliche as that sounds), instead of finding a slum with other mexicans who also cant read, write or speak english and being a leaf blower for the rest of your life.

if that's the case and i believe it to be, then i wholly agree with litteraly booting these people (any illegals) out of the country and tell them to become a citizen properly. Even if you have to wait 10 years for a green card, you can get a temp work Visa almost immeadiately and renew it as many times as you want for a small fee. But that's not the issue, the issue is that anyone who enters a country illegally is looking for a free ride, and that's why it's illegal.

it's horrible to see people that have been here for 20 years and are now getting kicked out, but i've seen some of these people and after 20 years they still dont speak english, they do day labor as a career and because of that, live in congregations of high crime areas and slums and grow like a cancer. To be fair though, there illegal immigrants who made a very good life for themselves and their family, but they're still living off my taxes and not contributing to the city, state, country etc. It's not the government's fault that you're being asked to leave or properly acquire citizenship - they knew it was wrong since the day they hopped the border, but it's not like we're destroying anyone's lives - Just follow the proper fucking legal channels people!

And yunno, english and spanish are very similar so if you know one of those languages its going to be easy to learn the other, but the fact remains that we are officially an english speaking country and anyone who enters her borders needs to respect that, srsly. I wouldn't live in france without trying to learn the language (i'd rather die though) or germany, netherlands, mexico, alabama, etc so if you dont know english, fucking LEARN IT, you dont even have to spell anything correctly hell you can make good in an advertizing firm misspelling things. And maybe, just *maybe* if mexicans, puerto ricans, etc weren't such a burden, maybe we wouldn't be trying to force them out now. i dont see any huge government petitions to force out illegal chinese, yunno?
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Tue, May 2nd, 2006   #12
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Even the natives travelled here. Humans aren't native to Earth so much as they are native to Kenya.
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Tue, May 2nd, 2006   #13
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Tue, May 2nd, 2006   #14
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Originally Posted by lazyfatbum
To be fair though, there illegal immigrants who made a very good life for themselves and their family, but they're still living off my taxes and not contributing to the city, state, country etc. It's not the government's fault that you're being asked to leave or properly acquire citizenship - they knew it was wrong since the day they hopped the border, but it's not like we're destroying anyone's lives - Just follow the proper fucking legal channels people!

I don't like the stand people take where they say illegal immigrants aren't contributing anything. What do you think they are doing here, just sitting around while their children get an education? They are working at jobs for a lot less than most Americans make, and this is a problem caused by businesses who are willing to circumvent the law by hiring them. If there weren't jobs for illegal immigrants they wouldn't be here so the businesses should be held just as accountable as the immigrants.
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And yunno, english and spanish are very similar so if you know one of those languages its going to be easy to learn the other, but the fact remains that we are officially an english speaking country and anyone who enters her borders needs to respect that, srsly.

Don't know where you got that lazy, but English and Spanish are not similar at all. In fact, English isn't similar to any other major language, which is why so many people have trouble learning it. I'm not saying immigrants to our country shouldn't learn English, but I am saying that it isn't the easiest thing for them especially if the job they work at consists entirely of Spanish-speaking illegal immigrants, as is the case for many of them.
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Tue, May 2nd, 2006   #15
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Miller, if you lived in LA, you would pick up spanish in about a year, in two years you'd be completely fluent. the languages are very similar, that's why it's easy for english speaking people to learn spanish and vice versa. This is factual information. (alot of people become fluent in less than two years)
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I don't like the stand people take where they say illegal immigrants aren't contributing anything. What do you think they are doing here, just sitting around while their children get an education? They are working at jobs for a lot less than most Americans make, and this is a problem caused by businesses who are willing to circumvent the law by hiring them. If there weren't jobs for illegal immigrants they wouldn't be here so the businesses should be held just as accountable as the immigrants.

hahaha holy krap, so THIS is what a liberal is, now i now why you guys are so hated. your opinion sorta projects a dream world, i'm sure you see that. there's no sense arguing it, there's no sense passing the blame around, the fact is that what's happening now is not working and is degrading to the lives all the peoples in the cities where this is hitting the hardest. Something needs to be done and since the root of the problem is people sneaking in to the country illegally, that is the problem that should be addressed.

Dont blame a business for hiring cheap labor, or say something ass-like such as 'well if we made mexico better they wouldn't want to leave" (sorry ABF :love, or tell me that we somehow need or depend on poor, uneducated people in droves who cannot understand english becase no matter how you slice it you will look retarded. you're taking the mentally of a weak person who wants to cater to changes instead of guide them in to what they should be. In your mind i wonder if you believe that schools should teach 7 different languages as first languges just *in case* other countries start jumping our borders. You're trying to work around the mess, but by getting serious about making sure people take the correct channels to enter and live in this country, we are cleaning it and making sure the mess doesn't happen again, even if that means some harsh tactics now, it will benefit us all in the long run.

You need to remember one simple thing - they entered this country illegally. It's not your fault, it's not mine, it's not the burden of the tax payers nor do we need to fiigure out how to help them. There are proper ways to do things and they choose not to. Again, making excuses for how i need to accept them or reasoning behind why we shouldn't start getting serious about it is a thought process devoid of testicles. you need to see the larger picture and stop the 'oh lets help everyone because we're God-like and put our own agendas a side for them' mentallity

btw i'm liberal too, i just strive to see the larger picture and not immeadiate satisfaction. Some people (i hope you're not one) believe America to be some kind benevolent teacher and guidance for the world, that even though people attack us, or enter us illegaly, we should cater to them and learn to 'understand them' and other pussy-fart faggot thinking that breeds weakness, apathy and self-destruction in the long run, just because it 'sounds nice' now.
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Tue, May 2nd, 2006   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lazyfatbum
Miller, if you lived in LA, you would pick up spanish in about a year, in two years you'd be completely fluent. the languages are very similar, that's why it's easy for english speaking people to learn spanish and vice versa. This is factual information. (alot of people become fluent in less than two years)

Lazy, just because it is easy for an English-speaking person to learn Spanish doesn't mean it's easy for a Spanish-speaking person to learn English. Wikipedia explains my point. The key sentence is "Although in terms of grammar, English is not particularly difficult to learn, there are several features of English which are relatively complex and therefore create difficulties for the majority of learners."

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hahaha holy krap, so THIS is what a liberal is, now i now why you guys are so hated. your opinion sorta projects a dream world, i'm sure you see that. there's no sense arguing it, there's no sense passing the blame around, the fact is that what's happening now is not working and is degrading to the lives all the peoples in the cities where this is hitting the hardest. Something needs to be done and since the root of the problem is people sneaking in to the country illegally, that is the problem that should be addressed.

I never said we shouldn't do anything about the problem. Obviously we need to do something because it is a huge problem, but the solution isn't to deport millions of people. This isn't feasible either economically or practically. My solution is to give the illegal immigrants a chance to gain their citizenship through the normal channels. If they refuse to do so then we give them the boot.
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Tue, May 2nd, 2006   #17
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I have to say I agree on some things lazy says, except I DO blame them for hiring cheap labor. Wait, that doesn't sound right, probably because that's not my position but a straw man.

Oh right, what I blame them for is hiring cheap labor when it breaks the law, for example paying below minimum wage to hire illegal aliens.
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Tue, May 2nd, 2006   #18
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Dont blame a business for hiring cheap labor, or say something ass-like such as 'well if we made mexico better they wouldn't want to leave" (sorry ABF :love, or tell me that we somehow need or depend on poor, uneducated people in droves who cannot understand english becase no matter how you slice it you will look retarded.

Actually, one of my professors was talking about this with me today, and he said that the best way to immediately stop illegal immigration, nearly 100%, is to pass a law that would make it illegal for anyone (business, etc) in this country to hire illegal immigrants, and set up an enforcement agency with inspectors. The punishment for hiring illegals would be a 1% dock on their yearly profits (or something similar). He then said that this is impossible because the corporations and agribusinesses that rely on cheap labor are also huge campaign contributors and as a result nothing of the sort would ever pass.

I hadn't thought of it that way, but he's probably right... though I do think that for it to work it'd have to be tied to some kind of aid to Central American nations to try to improve conditions there to make people less likely to want to leave (like, as I said, Western Europe did/is doing in Central/Eastern Europe) and increases in the American minimum wage -- substantial ones (to at least $7 or $8 certainly, and that'd just be a partial move to catch up on some of the value it's lost over the years as it hasn't kept up with inflation -- to make a real impact, it'd need to go higher than that.) It's completely ridiculous that our minimum wage is so low, and that forces Americans to need to buy cheap stuff, which requires cheap labor... and if you increase labor costs and make things better for those horribly exploited people (illegal immigrants working here), then you'd better improve things for Americans too...

But that won't happen either. The Republicans are the party of the top 1% or so, and that'd be very, very bad for them. (I know that on immigration the Democrats have far from a clean record either, but on the minimum wage it's much more clear...)
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Tue, May 2nd, 2006   #19
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Fences just plain won't work. The only way to keep them from coming is to have conditions in their countries be good enough that they don't want to come anymore...


Umm... how about no on that? This is our country. We have laws. If they don't respect those laws, and wish to break them in order to come here, then they should be punished. It's a no brainer. Washington won't do anything about it.

Enter the Minutemen.
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Tue, May 2nd, 2006   #20
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Read my last post. That might work. Fences? Absolutely absurd. You cannot keep people out if they really want to get in... maybe we could keep out a few more than we do, but a lot of them would still get in. If they want to get in, they'll find a way... while doing a better job at border security is perhaps a good idea, finding ways to not make them want to try to come here illegally is a much better idea that has a much higher chance of success (that is, greater than zero).
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Tue, May 2nd, 2006   #21
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Here's the thing. A super long fence is just idiotic. It's nice that so far the group building the thing is freelance funding it themselves at any rate, but it is still foolish.

I seem to recall some other country attempting to divide their land from those they didn't want coming in with a massive wall of some sort. That didn't work out too well for them. I'm thinking... something about China? Then again that "wall" was actually many different projects in different eras, some of it now underground, and none of the different projects connected (and certainly not visible from space, at least not in the way that's often said, because it is visible from space in the same way my house is).

Oh, let's build a fence. Might as well wall off our nation with a red velvet rope like it's a museum exibit.
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Wed, May 3rd, 2006   #22
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Lazy, just because it is easy for an English-speaking person to learn Spanish doesn't mean it's easy for a Spanish-speaking person to learn English. Wikipedia explains my point. The key sentence is "Although in terms of grammar, English is not particularly difficult to learn, there are several features of English which are relatively complex and therefore create difficulties for the majority of learners."

That's mostly slang and 'American English' that create complexities, but i'm talking about just the ability to read, write and speak english; The complexities can be completely avoided and is only present in people who have lived in the country for years. But the base language to the point of being able to communicate takes weeks at the most if you're living in an environment that uses the language you are trying to learn.
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I never said we shouldn't do anything about the problem. Obviously we need to do something because it is a huge problem, but the solution isn't to deport millions of people. This isn't feasible either economically or practically.

you'll have to explain this, you think that there are no Americans who will be leaf blowers and house painters, landscapers, roofers etc? Those jobs will be filled the next day and they will paid full wages, sign a W2, pay taxes, get benefits, have lunch breaks, etc. Unlike how the illegals were treated.
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My solution is to give the illegal immigrants a chance to gain their citizenship through the normal channels. If they refuse to do so then we give them the boot.

that's exactly what i said All illegal immigrants have that choice but they WONT DO IT.
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what I blame them for is hiring cheap labor when it breaks the law, for example paying below minimum wage to hire illegal aliens. /DJ

Actually, one of my professors was talking about this with me today, and he said that the best way to immediately stop illegal immigration, nearly 100%, is to pass a law that would make it illegal for anyone (business, etc) in this country to hire illegal immigrants, and set up an enforcement agency with inspectors. The punishment for hiring illegals would be a 1% dock on their yearly profits (or something similar). He then said that this is impossible because the corporations and agribusinesses that rely on cheap labor are also huge campaign contributors and as a result nothing of the sort would ever pass.

I hadn't thought of it that way, but he's probably right... though I do think that for it to work it'd have to be tied to some kind of aid to Central American nations to try to improve conditions there to make people less likely to want to leave (like, as I said, Western Europe did/is doing in Central/Eastern Europe) and increases in the American minimum wage -- substantial ones (to at least $7 or $8 certainly, and that'd just be a partial move to catch up on some of the value it's lost over the years as it hasn't kept up with inflation -- to make a real impact, it'd need to go higher than that.) It's completely ridiculous that our minimum wage is so low, and that forces Americans to need to buy cheap stuff, which requires cheap labor... and if you increase labor costs and make things better for those horribly exploited people (illegal immigrants working here), then you'd better improve things for Americans too...

But that won't happen either. The Republicans are the party of the top 1% or so, and that'd be very, very bad for them. (I know that on immigration the Democrats have far from a clean record either, but on the minimum wage it's much more clear...) /ABF


here's the situation: Businesses want to make money and spend as less money as possible, illegals want any job they can get, which is almost 100% of the time a slave labor position for rediculous pay. If they can hire someone for less, they'll do it. There is an orginization that inspects the business for the hiring of illegals, it's called the INS (who fines the companies who employ illegals). here's the problem: the businesses can fake all kinds of paper trails so that they can hold on to their illegals and give the INS the run around. The workers want to keep their slave-labor jobs because they cant get anything else especiially anything that might better themselves or give them a real career, forcing them to stay in slums and be used by corporations, the businesses want to keep their cheap laborers, the INS has to show proper documentation and valid proof - Both the businesses and ilegals are forging documentation and proof of citizenship. the end result: immigrants are treated as slave labor, businesses are forged in to labor camps, and nothing can be done.

We cant stop what happens outside the US, when nike opens a new factory in china we all know it's slave labor, people getting paid 50 cents a day, child-labor etc. We know that coffee and orange juice comes from slave labor. So if the illegals were forced out of the country, some of these business might go under because that's what they prfoited the most from (this goes with Miller's response), but these corporations NEED to be shutdown and forced to create a legal business model instead of growing fat on the backs of illegal immigrants.

the illegals suffer, the businesses profit. the only solution is to litteraly force people in to becoming legal. if they're removed from the country - they can get back in within a month or two legally. yes it sucks, they may lose their apartment, be taken from their families, etc. But that is their *own fault* and it can be avoided by taking the steps to become legal NOW. and when they return, they can get REAL jobs have careers, move out of the slums and create a real life. doesn't anyone understand that what is happening now is one step away from slavery? of course there are exceptions to every rule, there are illegals who did quite well for themselves; artists, computer engineers, mechanics, construction management but these people eventually became legal so their self-owned businesses and careers could, yunno, make money and not be shutdown and I gaurantee you every one of those handful of success stories were of illegals who could speak english. (and i'm just talking about mexicans, but also irish, italians, german, hell everyone going back to 200 years ago).

fences just dont work, I mean it's just as rediculous as anything else that's been tried, but they litteraly do not work. We need a new plan and a better government to handle that plan, the only way to solve the issue is to wipe the slate and start over the way it should have been done an era ago so that someday we can see a USA/Mexico border without ASSAULT RIFLES and TANKS. it's like fucking berlin all over again. Remove the walls and formulate a better government and plan that wont paint itself in to a corner again, atleast on this issue anyway.

Last edited by A Black Falcon : Wed, May 3rd, 2006 at 11:40 AM.
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Thu, May 4th, 2006   #23
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You need to stop dilluting the problem. It doesn't matter if business make money from illegals. It doesn't matter if English is hard to learn.

They are here illegally, without permission, which means that they have no respect for our laws or way of life. It means that they are opportunists who came here to leach off of our economy.

Build a wall.
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Thu, May 4th, 2006   #24
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Have you read nothing we've written about why that wouldn't work?

Thought not...
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Thu, May 4th, 2006   #25
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...they are opportunists who came here to leach off of our economy.

You mean just like your great, great, great grandpa and grandma? Just like everyone's forefathers? I'm here because some dude from germany said "Man fuck Germany, there's better opportunity in America."

there's nothing wrong at all in moving in to a country for better opportunities, whether it's business related or to escape oppressive government or just to have a better life. just go through the proper channels to achieve it.

you sound like a bigot imo, but a government, a country, is a tool to be used and exploited by its people for their own betterment. And hopefully that government can offer its citizens that ability to grow in a stable, effective orginization. as this evolves, you generate a huge economy where people believe they have no limit as to what success can be achieved, and the government that supports such a mentality becomes strong and dynamic to the point that peoples of other governments will want to be a part of it and that should be welcomed. and if they enter this government with a goal of becoming a citizen, they will absorb the core of the government and find a path to their success. If they dont, and believe that they should hide, and live in it illegally, then they are still outside its influence even though they live within it and will never able to benefit from it.

Walls should be removed, all people (sans muslims ) should be invited to become a citizen and use this government like a tool to better themselves and anyone who hides here who is not a citizen and tries to find a pocket of their people who are also in hiding who refuse to be a part of the country should be forced to become one or forced to leave. it's really as simple as that.
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Thu, May 4th, 2006   #26
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Have you read nothing we've written about why that wouldn't work?

Nope.


You mean just like your great, great, great grandpa and grandma? Just like everyone's forefathers?

No, not like them... because they came here legally, learned English, and assimilated.

Walls should be removed, all people (sans muslims ) should be invited to become a citizen and use this government like a tool to better themselves and anyone who hides here who is not a citizen and tries to find a pocket of their people who are also in hiding who refuse to be a part of the country should be forced to become one or forced to leave. it's really as simple as that.

It's as simple as that in your opinion.
The vast majority of citizens are against illegal immigration. It's illegal. Deport them. I don't see how this is at all unclear to any body... its open and shut, black and white, day and night.
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Tue, May 23rd, 2006   #27
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We should just annex the rest of Mexico, finishing what we started in the 1840's. We can have complete control over their oil fields, thus we won't have to rely so much on Middle East oil, and the illegal immigrants will become legal citizens. We can make them pay taxes and give them all the rights and obligations of full-fledged citizens. No more babysitting criminals.

But a full annexation of Mexico is not likely to ever happen, so... let's just deport the bastards. Glad to see we're finally putting troops on the border. We don't need another under-the-table-paid janitor. If legal immigrants with real skills want to come here and live with all the same rights and obligations as the rest of us legal citizens, they are more than welcome. Also, Star-Spangled Banner was written in English and should stay in English. Learn the damn language if you're gonna live a public life here.
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Tue, May 23rd, 2006   #28
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Good idea, Geno. That'd solve everybody's problems.
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Tue, May 23rd, 2006   #29
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And it wouldn't create ANY problems, EVER!
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Tue, May 23rd, 2006   #30
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You know what I like?

Immigrants who come to this country illegally, live here illegally, and have the nerve to protest our laws!

Swim yo asses back to Mexico and shut the fuck up.
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Wed, May 24th, 2006   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan
You know what I like?

Immigrants who come to this country illegally, live here illegally, and have the nerve to protest our laws!

Swim yo asses back to Mexico and shut the fuck up.
I have a friend who lives in California who, along with other angry legal citizens, went to the immigrants' protest to protest their protest. But yeah, he held up a sign that said "We don't reward criminals!" He was rather amused when an old lady standing next to him said "Go the fuck back to Mexico!"
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Wed, May 31st, 2006   #32
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Fri, June 2nd, 2006   #33
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Habla ingls por favor.
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Sun, September 3rd, 2006   #34
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You silly americans you can go build a wall for all I care!

Just remeber who built Roma and inspired your founding fathers to build your country into the free society it is having all come from the Voltaire movement dessecting studying rip off all the Latin & greek ideas!!

If you have been to say mexico for instance, You will quite often see shantis and slums everywhere if you know where to look , Isnt it sad that with hollywood & Cilicon valley up north all that whealth and waste that people still live in ghettos and shit holes not even miles from it where having clean uncomtaminated water is actually a luxxury.

The Simple matter is everytime a leader in latin america actually tries to do what he is sopposed too provide for the public improve living conditions , Generally leftist socialist types ok! The cronnies in haliburton or exxon also numberous local obligarch fearful that for instance the oil would actually be nationalised and taken away from foreign hands, Will give someone a call in the CIA and have that leader taken out.

Docter Ernesto aka Che Guevara was murderd thanks to CIA assistance after all he was a dirty pinko !! All he wanted was to put a end to the very injustices that force people to migrate into your country in heap loads.

What happend to the america of Cincinnatus!!
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Sun, September 3rd, 2006   #35
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We should have kept Mexico when we captured it a hundred and fifty years ago. The nation would be far better off today. To that end, no, I don't feel any guilt for the plight of Mexico. It's just one of many nations that has proven itself completely incompetent in regards to sovereignty. When your government is providing you with instructions on how to get out, you have a government that has failed miserably. Mexico is an independent nation, it needs to start acting like one by cracking down on the drug empires and corruption and get their shit straight, because the Mexico that exists today doesn't really deserve to be an independent nation.

Che Guevara was a murderous thug, and his legacy lives on in a way most appropriate for his relevance; on T-shirts sold at Hot Topic.

You may note that no one here is against Mexican immigration when it's done legally.
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Sun, September 3rd, 2006   #36
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Legal immigration through the proper channels is fine. Millions upon millions of people pouring across the border illegally is not.
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