A Black Falcon

Not much more than FPSes? But I have over 200 PC games and about 10 are FPSes... huh, I didn't know that the rest of my games are actually the minority...

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My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

List out all of the big games that came out this year. Most of them are FPS's.

Great Rumbler

Farcry, Unreal Tournament 2004, Doom 3, Half-Life 2 [soon to be released], Painkiller, Theif Deadly Shadows, and I'm sure there are more but that's what I can think of off the top of my head.

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My name is Great Rumbler and I'm from the Sub-Human Tractor Planet! ZOOP!!

Read my web log.

A Black Falcon

But there are SO MANY PC games released... there have been a lot of games released in each genre. FPSes are just really popular so they (and strategy games) get the most publicity for PC. But for big upcoming titles that might make this year, how about Rome: Total War, Kohan II, World of Warcraft, EverQuest 2, Warhammer 40K: Dawn of War, The Sims 2, Guild Wars, Lineage II, Ground Control II, Beyond Divinity... I think you get my point...

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

Right, but look at the top ten lists. Mostly FPS's throughout the year. Aside from The Sims.

A Black Falcon

No, strategy games do just as well... and casual/budget mass-market games, of course.

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

Most of the top ten games are FPS's.

A Black Falcon

Most of the top 10 are The Sims, it often seems...

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

Well aside from that. That's just weird.

A Black Falcon

No, it's not. 'Casual' gamers are big force in PC gaming and they buy The Sims and Zoo Tycoon, not Painkiller...

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

Well nobody cares about them.

A Black Falcon

Retailers and game developers do...

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

Do you?

A Black Falcon

I care inasmuch as it's interesting to see what people buy and that I have to recognize that if a lot of people buy a game there has to be SOME kind of appeal. Oh, casual gamers often buy things that aren't that great... but some of those you can see why they have appeal. Not violent, not as challenging in many ways... Doom doesn't exactly appeal to everyone while Rollercoaster Tycoon does. Deer Hunter of course was just an abysmal game that was the only one of its kind and hit a market no one new existed.

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

Great Rumbler

Still, the fact is that a lot of good FPSs have been released in the past year.

__________________
My name is Great Rumbler and I'm from the Sub-Human Tractor Planet! ZOOP!!

Read my web log.

A Black Falcon

That is certainly true. And they are one of the PCs most popular genes. But the point is that they aren't the only one, not even close.

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

There are the most popular among harcore PC gamers. If you look at the monthly sales charts there's always a bunch of FPS's and the obvious casual title like the sims.

A Black Falcon

And some strategy games, OB1, and some strategy games...

For instance, here are two lists from weeks in July..

week ending July 10
http://pc.ign.com/articles/532/532687p1.html

week ending July 3
http://pc.ign.com/articles/530/530063p1.html

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

Once in a while, but it's almost always shooters at the top.

Great Rumbler

In each one of those charts 4 of the 10 games are FPSs.

__________________
My name is Great Rumbler and I'm from the Sub-Human Tractor Planet! ZOOP!!

Read my web log.

A Black Falcon

The first has four FPSes, three RTSes, two 'casual' games (Sims and MS Flight Simulator), and a MMORPG. The second has four FPSes, two RTSes, three 'casual' games (those two and Harry Potter), and the MMORPG. Supports my opinion, I'd think.

February 2003. Top 20.
http://pc.ign.com/articles/390/390054p1.html

Four RTSes, three Sims, four FPSes, MMORPG, racing, TBS, third-person action, three more 'casual' strategy games, harry potter, spongebob...

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

Yeah you're picking out one or two odd months. Look at the annual sales charts.

A Black Falcon

No, I just picked a random month. And that seems like just about what I see in PC sales charts. Some FPSes, some RTSes, some other miscelaneous games, and a bunch of stuff for casual users. Quite typical.

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

Dude, just look at the stupid annual sales charts and you'll see what I mean.

A Black Falcon

Then post some! But I've been looking at PC game charts for a long time and am certain that I am right.

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

You post them!

A Black Falcon

I've posted links to three or four lists, all of which look exactly like most PC game lists I've ever seen. You overestimate how many FPSes show up on these lists, OB1. I've been reading PC game sales charts for many years and know what they typically look like.

January 10th-16th, 1999. http://pc.ign.com/articles/066/066660p1.html

The only true FPS is Half-Life. Though I guess Deer Hunter is one too...

Best selling games of 1998. http://pc.ign.com/articles/066/066602p1.html

December 2002. http://pc.ign.com/articles/383/383478p1.html

As all of the lists I have posted have proven, it's often about half and half hardcore and casual games. Often more casual than hardcore, really, but sometimes it's the other way around. Casual games are a mix of strategy titles, MS Flight Simulator titles, bad games (like Deer Hunter...), liscenced junk, etc... while hardcore titles are mostly strategy games (heavy on RTSes) and FPS games. As well as a few others, like some MMORPGs.

Anyway, I've proven my point. I don't know what ratio of titles you expected, but I've been reading these lists long enough to know what kind of mix goes into top lists of PC games better than you.

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

Those aren't annual charts, dork.

A Black Falcon

Look at my edited post, OB1. 1998 annual list. And December 2002.

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

That was 1998. 2004 is not 1998.

Hey look, the number of replies in this thread is almost the same as the number of views. Amazing.

A Black Falcon

2004 isn't 1998, but PC game buying habits haven't changed very much. Console habits haven't, so why should PC?

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

That's a very ridiculous claim. Just look up the 2003 chart.

Dark Jaguar

Okay, just thought I'd add this. The ATI 4.9 drivers, full version, are now out. They claim to do a much better job of handling Doom 3. Anyway, having used them, I can say they fixed all the glitches in the beta, and more to the point, there are no longer any transitions between various modes (such as playing a DVD to normal, where before the screen would black out for a second, now it's smooth). Anyway, just thought I'd mention it.

Oh yes, there is a Doom 3 demo now (it was inevitable). I'm downloading it myself to see how it runs on my machine, and also how it plays period.

__________________
"On two occasions, I have been asked [by members of Parliament], 'Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?' I am not able to rightly apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question." ~ Charles Babbage (1791-1871)

Dark Jaguar

Okay, got it, played it for a bit, and now have an opinion.

First off, my computer can almost handle it perfectly at top quality with resolution of 1024x768. I say "almost" because the game has finally pushed my system just beyond what it's capable of. Either A, my video card needs more RAM, or B, that's not the issue, the issue is my mother board doesn't transfer data between my system ram to the video card fast enough. I KNOW I have enough system ram (a gig should do it even for this game), it's gotta be one of those two things. I have 256MB of video card ram, so next time I get a card, a few years from now, I'll aim for either 512 or a gig. Anyway, the main issue is whenever some new model is being loaded for the first time (excluding the stuff automatically loaded into ram when the level loads up), the game freezes for a couple seconds until it's done. After that, no issues though.

So, having seen this game at full capacity... well, I am not THAT impressed. It looks good but, eh, it's not jaw dropping or anything... Yes, it's got a lot of texture levels on every model, yes there's a lot of detail, and yes those various effects do look nice but, well... I guess I expected more... I think it might be the art style. It's so... typical of American games. And, the sad thing is American game developers, by and large, are FINALLY growing out of this whole style themselves. Everything just seems so... bland. Detailed, but bland. I think it's a lovely engine, but I would like to see it used on some actual decent environments. Load up something based on the Mana game's art style and let me run around there... killing demons with shotguns.

Anyway, the game does have a nice creepyness to it, decent anyway. The idea that putting away the flashlight leaves me with a menacing sillouette heading towards me is nice. I will say this. It's actually SCARY as opposed to the first two Doom games. I'm not even talking about how the art style is laughable to any adult, I'm talking about how it's pure action with not a single bit of scariness in it, at all. It's like a fight scene in a movie. That part itself is never scary, it's the part where the guy is behind the other guy and you catch a glint of the knife. Of course, that example is cheesy, but at least it's standard scary. That about describes the spookiness of this game, cheesy, but decent. They did seem to add a lot of interactivity with the various files. The story, for what it is, also seems to be told well enough. Too bad it's Doom here. I mean, the idea of opening a portal into the demon world is a concept that COULD work, even if it's scientists who do it. That in and of itself could still make a good story. However, when every single demon is a bloodthirsty braindead creature out to kill all humans, every single chance for the story to be good, at all, has just flown out the window forever.

Sooo, I guess I'll get back to the demo later and go beyond the room where I decided to see if going into a bunch of gears in the floor would be deadly or not. I'm only like halfway through the second level of the demo (maybe halfway, not really sure). The demo has 3 levels total, so not much left. If I'm not wowed, this demo is going bye-bye when I'm done with it, and I'll be left not wanting to buy this game at all. Also, there's no multiplayer demo.

__________________
"On two occasions, I have been asked [by members of Parliament], 'Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?' I am not able to rightly apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question." ~ Charles Babbage (1791-1871)

OB1

Yes, the engine is very nice but the game doesn't look all that great, thanks to the terrible art. And the lighting, which is supposed to be the most impressive aspect of the engine, is barely shown off in the game as everything is just pitch black.

Dark Jaguar

And now I've completed the demo. It played pretty much the same in the 3rd level as in the first. I suspect meeting up with my teammates in the real game will be put off for about 5 levels, and at the very moment I meet the only one who survived, that guy will die some horrible death (or be possessed) and I'll be going it alone into the underworld.

Anyway, it's certainly a major step up from the original (not saying much). But, well... honestly, this demo has not convinced me to buy the game. It's just not worth the cash. If someone tells me the rest of the game is far far superior to the first 3 levels, then maybe. Also, if someone tells me the multiplayer is "awesome", then maybe. But, as of now, that demo is being deleted.

__________________
"On two occasions, I have been asked [by members of Parliament], 'Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?' I am not able to rightly apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question." ~ Charles Babbage (1791-1871)

A Black Falcon

OB1, can you manage some kind of admission here?

http://www.npd.com/press/releases/press_040722.htm

http://www.npd.com/press/releases/press_040126a.htm

http://www.npd.com/dynamic/releases/press_050119.html

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff

OB1

what?

A Black Falcon

Just proving you can be wrong, how little you like to admit it... well, until you redefine your arguement until you're right again...

__________________
My Games Collection My Webpage!
Currently Playing: Guild Wars (with expansions) (PC), Donkey Kong Country series (SNES), Summon Night: Swordcraft Story 1 and 2 (GBA), sometimes Warcraft III or Starcraft (PC) Mega Turrican and Universal Soldier (Genesis), various other stuff